Breast Cancer Logo - TYFTS Breast Cancer Podcast

Breast Cancer At 23 With Justine

Meet Justine. She is a 10-year breast cancer survivor, a psychology professor, and a certified yoga teacher. She runs the Instagram account @yogawithjus, where she shares about her survivorship, flattie fashion and holds weekly meditation for the breast cancer community. In this episode, Justine shares with us what it was like being diagnosed at just 23 years old such as navigating college full-time while undergoing treatment and the lack of resources for young women with breast cancer. Now in her early 30s, she shares the difficult decision to remove her breast implants and opt to go flat (aesthetic flat closure surgery).

Resources

Transcript

1

00:00:00,000 –> 00:00:04,200

I remember thinking, well, if I make it to 30, I’m going to be stoked.

 

2

00:00:04,200 –> 00:00:05,720

I made it to 30.

 

3

00:00:05,720 –> 00:00:09,680

Now I’m looking to 40 and I’m like, all right, let’s go to 40.

 

4

00:00:09,680 –> 00:00:11,560

Hi everyone.

 

5

00:00:11,560 –> 00:00:15,400

Welcome to season two.

 

6

00:00:15,400 –> 00:00:16,400

This is Shauna.

 

7

00:00:16,400 –> 00:00:17,760

And this is Rosalina.

 

8

00:00:17,760 –> 00:00:20,800

And we’re your hosts for Too Young for This Shit podcast.

 

9

00:00:20,800 –> 00:00:25,300

This podcast is not just about boobs, but a journey with cancer.

 

10

00:00:25,300 –> 00:00:31,600

We are young millennials open about giving you our raw and unfiltered look into our lives.

 

11

00:00:31,600 –> 00:00:36,400

We are in no way medical professionals, nor are we offering medical advice.

 

12

00:00:36,400 –> 00:00:42,000

Any medical references are cited directly from public websites or form our personal

 

13

00:00:42,000 –> 00:00:43,000

diagnosis.

 

14

00:00:43,000 –> 00:00:49,320

Some topics and stories may be triggering to those who are fighting, have fought, or

 

15

00:00:49,320 –> 00:00:52,280

have loved someone with cancer.

 

16

00:00:52,280 –> 00:00:53,480

Hi everyone.

 

17

00:00:53,480 –> 00:00:55,480

This is Rosalina.

 

18

00:00:55,480 –> 00:00:56,480

And this is Shauna.

 

19

00:00:56,480 –> 00:00:59,280

Welcome back to the Too Young for This Show podcast.

 

20

00:00:59,280 –> 00:01:08,000

Our guest today is Justine, a social psychologist, college professor, and a certified yoga teacher.

 

21

00:01:08,000 –> 00:01:14,160

She runs an Instagram account called Yoga with Just where she shares about her survivorship

 

22

00:01:14,160 –> 00:01:18,000

and holds weekly meditation for the breast cancer community.

 

23

00:01:18,000 –> 00:01:19,000

Hi Justine.

 

24

00:01:19,000 –> 00:01:22,640

Thank you so much for joining us.

 

25

00:01:22,640 –> 00:01:23,920

Thank you so much for having me.

 

26

00:01:23,920 –> 00:01:25,560

I’m really excited to be here.

 

27

00:01:25,560 –> 00:01:26,560

Yes.

 

28

00:01:26,560 –> 00:01:30,120

I am so excited to just like dive into your journey.

 

29

00:01:30,120 –> 00:01:34,800

But before we do that, can you tell the listeners just a little bit about yourself, just not

 

30

00:01:34,800 –> 00:01:40,360

cancer related, you know, like your age, career, interests, hobbies?

 

31

00:01:40,360 –> 00:01:41,360

Yeah.

 

32

00:01:41,360 –> 00:01:45,760

So I’m originally from Connecticut, but I’m currently living in Rhode Island.

 

33

00:01:45,760 –> 00:01:49,920

I’ve been in Rhode Island for over a decade now.

 

34

00:01:49,920 –> 00:01:54,440

And I’m 33 and a psychology professor, as you noted.

 

35

00:01:54,440 –> 00:02:00,280

And so I’ve been doing that for over five years now after I got my PhD in psychology.

 

36

00:02:00,280 –> 00:02:04,720

And interests and hobbies, you know, we’ll talk a little bit about the yoga meditation

 

37

00:02:04,720 –> 00:02:06,440

stuff later.

 

38

00:02:06,440 –> 00:02:08,200

But I also love to cook.

 

39

00:02:08,200 –> 00:02:11,120

So I like trying different recipes, especially after cancer.

 

40

00:02:11,120 –> 00:02:17,880

Like I really got into just trying new and different ways of enjoying like nutrition.

 

41

00:02:17,880 –> 00:02:23,560

So like different vegan dishes and that to be said, I don’t solely eat vegan.

 

42

00:02:23,560 –> 00:02:28,280

I’m a person that feels really strongly about moderation is key for me.

 

43

00:02:28,280 –> 00:02:29,760

And so, yeah, hiking.

 

44

00:02:29,760 –> 00:02:31,840

We love to hike with our dog.

 

45

00:02:31,840 –> 00:02:34,840

We have a dog named Maddie and we have two ferrets.

 

46

00:02:34,840 –> 00:02:38,280

Their names are May and Watts and they’re really curious and silly.

 

47

00:02:38,280 –> 00:02:42,080

When I, sorry, short story.

 

48

00:02:42,080 –> 00:02:46,280

When I was a kid, I had a friend who had a ferret and I thought it was the coolest thing

 

49

00:02:46,280 –> 00:02:47,280

ever.

 

50

00:02:47,280 –> 00:02:48,280

They’re really sweet.

 

51

00:02:48,280 –> 00:02:49,280

Yeah, they are.

 

52

00:02:49,280 –> 00:02:50,280

They really are.

 

53

00:02:50,280 –> 00:02:54,600

My sister wanted one so bad, but I think like in New York, they’re illegal.

 

54

00:02:54,600 –> 00:02:56,200

You can’t have them as pets in New York.

 

55

00:02:56,200 –> 00:02:57,200

Yeah.

 

56

00:02:57,200 –> 00:03:00,880

In certain states, they’re illegal or they’re like really regulated because they’re exotics.

 

57

00:03:00,880 –> 00:03:04,080

So it’s really weird.

 

58

00:03:04,080 –> 00:03:08,520

So Justine, let’s just get into your cancer diagnosis.

 

59

00:03:08,520 –> 00:03:16,920

At 23 years old, you were diagnosed with breast cancer and that was 10 years ago.

 

60

00:03:16,920 –> 00:03:23,400

But before we get into your cancer story, at that age, what did you know about breast

 

61

00:03:23,400 –> 00:03:24,400

cancer?

 

62

00:03:24,400 –> 00:03:26,400

Oh God, nothing.

 

63

00:03:26,400 –> 00:03:31,280

Literally, I mean, when I say nothing, I had no family history.

 

64

00:03:31,280 –> 00:03:33,680

I didn’t know anyone.

 

65

00:03:33,680 –> 00:03:42,720

I heard a friend’s aunt or grandma passed away or something right from cancer, but it

 

66

00:03:42,720 –> 00:03:48,800

was women in their 60s and 70s, not people my age and nothing like that.

 

67

00:03:48,800 –> 00:03:51,360

So I had no idea about really any of it.

 

68

00:03:51,360 –> 00:03:56,400

The only stories I knew were people who had passed and those were people who were very

 

69

00:03:56,400 –> 00:03:58,680

tangentially associated.

 

70

00:03:58,680 –> 00:03:59,920

I was associated with.

 

71

00:03:59,920 –> 00:04:02,320

So really no nothing.

 

72

00:04:02,320 –> 00:04:06,800

And that’s so important to say because this is just like a judgment free zone.

 

73

00:04:06,800 –> 00:04:11,280

I did not, I didn’t know much about breast cancer either.

 

74

00:04:11,280 –> 00:04:17,480

It wasn’t talked about in school and just people around me.

 

75

00:04:17,480 –> 00:04:21,720

And like you mentioned, the only time you heard about breast cancer is that it happens

 

76

00:04:21,720 –> 00:04:24,040

to women over 40.

 

77

00:04:24,040 –> 00:04:27,560

Unfortunately, it can happen to anyone.

 

78

00:04:27,560 –> 00:04:34,560

Now jumping into your cancer journey, take us through the beginning, starting with how

 

79

00:04:34,560 –> 00:04:36,280

you found your lump.

 

80

00:04:36,280 –> 00:04:37,280

Yeah.

 

81

00:04:37,280 –> 00:04:42,480

So I was, like I said, 23, I just finished my first year of grad school.

 

82

00:04:42,480 –> 00:04:47,080

So I was like trying to use the summer to like get ahead on my master’s thesis proposal

 

83

00:04:47,080 –> 00:04:49,240

and try to even graduate early.

 

84

00:04:49,240 –> 00:04:54,480

I was, you know, I was ahead of the game and I kind of found my lump by chance in the shower.

 

85

00:04:54,480 –> 00:04:59,240

So just to be very clear and open, you know, I wasn’t doing self exams because I wasn’t

 

86

00:04:59,240 –> 00:05:00,240

normalized.

 

87

00:05:00,240 –> 00:05:03,680

That wasn’t a thing that was like, Hey, you should be doing this and you know, feel it

 

88

00:05:03,680 –> 00:05:04,680

on the first.

 

89

00:05:04,680 –> 00:05:07,960

Those things were just not conversations had in any sort of space.

 

90

00:05:07,960 –> 00:05:08,960

Right.

 

91

00:05:08,960 –> 00:05:09,960

To do it monthly.

 

92

00:05:09,960 –> 00:05:10,960

Yeah.

 

93

00:05:10,960 –> 00:05:14,480

My breast exam happened when I went to my like annual gynecology appointment.

 

94

00:05:14,480 –> 00:05:16,720

And like that was when you had your breast exam done.

 

95

00:05:16,720 –> 00:05:17,720

Exactly.

 

96

00:05:17,720 –> 00:05:18,720

And that was it.

 

97

00:05:18,720 –> 00:05:20,200

And so, you know, I wasn’t super concerned.

 

98

00:05:20,200 –> 00:05:23,280

You know, the first thing I did, 23, called my mom.

 

99

00:05:23,280 –> 00:05:25,440

Hey mom, I felt this lump.

 

100

00:05:25,440 –> 00:05:26,960

What do I do?

 

101

00:05:26,960 –> 00:05:28,880

And she’s like, well, call your gynecologist.

 

102

00:05:28,880 –> 00:05:31,240

And she was really, she’s the one who encouraged me to do that.

 

103

00:05:31,240 –> 00:05:32,240

And she wasn’t worried either.

 

104

00:05:32,240 –> 00:05:35,920

I mean, but she’s like, you know, you don’t know, let’s just check it out.

 

105

00:05:35,920 –> 00:05:39,080

And we actually had a family trip to Vegas scheduled the next week.

 

106

00:05:39,080 –> 00:05:45,560

And so I ended up scheduling that appointment for like two weeks after that trip or something,

 

107

00:05:45,560 –> 00:05:48,200

because that was just the way the timing was going to work out.

 

108

00:05:48,200 –> 00:05:49,840

And I wasn’t really stressing about it.

 

109

00:05:49,840 –> 00:05:51,040

I went on that trip.

 

110

00:05:51,040 –> 00:05:53,040

There’s pictures of me, like I look back at those pictures.

 

111

00:05:53,040 –> 00:05:54,040

I’m smiling.

 

112

00:05:54,040 –> 00:05:57,720

Little did I know I had cancer in me, which is wild to think about.

 

113

00:05:57,720 –> 00:05:58,720

Yeah.

 

114

00:05:58,720 –> 00:05:59,720

Yeah.

 

115

00:05:59,720 –> 00:06:00,720

And so I got back.

 

116

00:06:00,720 –> 00:06:05,480

I had the appointment with my gynecologist and he wasn’t really concerned either.

 

117

00:06:05,480 –> 00:06:08,560

He said, you know, I think this is like a benign fibroedema.

 

118

00:06:08,560 –> 00:06:09,560

You’re young.

 

119

00:06:09,560 –> 00:06:10,560

You don’t have a family history.

 

120

00:06:10,560 –> 00:06:12,880

You shouldn’t really be concerned.

 

121

00:06:12,880 –> 00:06:16,920

And I went back, you know, after I was diagnosed and I actually thanked him because I went

 

122

00:06:16,920 –> 00:06:20,760

and he’s like, you know what, let’s send you for an ultrasound just in case.

 

123

00:06:20,760 –> 00:06:24,240

Doesn’t hurt to get it looked at and got the ultrasound.

 

124

00:06:24,240 –> 00:06:27,840

I remember sitting there and, you know, laying there, my mom went with me because this was

 

125

00:06:27,840 –> 00:06:32,920

pre-COVID time, so she was able to do that and because I was really nervous, of course.

 

126

00:06:32,920 –> 00:06:36,400

And I remember I think it was either Shauna or Rosalina.

 

127

00:06:36,400 –> 00:06:40,880

I can’t remember which one of you had talked about this in your episode, but the silence

 

128

00:06:40,880 –> 00:06:42,880

of the technician.

 

129

00:06:42,880 –> 00:06:43,880

I remember.

 

130

00:06:43,880 –> 00:06:44,880

Yeah, that was me.

 

131

00:06:44,880 –> 00:06:45,880

Yeah.

 

132

00:06:45,880 –> 00:06:46,880

So silent.

 

133

00:06:46,880 –> 00:06:47,880

OK.

 

134

00:06:47,880 –> 00:06:48,880

And just the clicking.

 

135

00:06:48,880 –> 00:06:50,840

There was so many clicks that they were doing to measure.

 

136

00:06:50,840 –> 00:06:52,140

And I remember that.

 

137

00:06:52,140 –> 00:06:54,160

That was freaking me out hard.

 

138

00:06:54,160 –> 00:06:55,160

Yeah.

 

139

00:06:55,160 –> 00:06:59,440

So it was complete silence and, you know, for me, it was like, you know, there was the

 

140

00:06:59,440 –> 00:07:00,720

spot where my lump was.

 

141

00:07:00,720 –> 00:07:03,920

But then there was the lit up with the calcification.

 

142

00:07:03,920 –> 00:07:09,900

So I had all these calcifications in my breast, which is also associated with the breast cancer.

 

143

00:07:09,900 –> 00:07:10,900

And she was silent.

 

144

00:07:10,900 –> 00:07:12,640

She walked up there and said, I’m going to go get the doctor.

 

145

00:07:12,640 –> 00:07:13,640

I said, OK.

 

146

00:07:13,640 –> 00:07:14,640

I didn’t like that.

 

147

00:07:14,640 –> 00:07:15,640

But I just sat there.

 

148

00:07:15,640 –> 00:07:16,640

Yes, that happened to me, too.

 

149

00:07:16,640 –> 00:07:17,640

I started crying.

 

150

00:07:17,640 –> 00:07:18,640

Yes.

 

151

00:07:18,640 –> 00:07:19,640

The radiologist comes back.

 

152

00:07:19,640 –> 00:07:24,640

He, you know, my BIRAD score was super high.

 

153

00:07:24,640 –> 00:07:27,080

I mean, they were like, yeah, this is probably cancer.

 

154

00:07:27,080 –> 00:07:29,160

You were going to obviously send you for a biopsy.

 

155

00:07:29,160 –> 00:07:31,160

And I was like, great.

 

156

00:07:31,160 –> 00:07:34,720

But we still have to do a mammogram because of insurance purposes, even though it’s very

 

157

00:07:34,720 –> 00:07:35,720

likely that it’s cancer.

 

158

00:07:35,720 –> 00:07:37,760

So I had to go through the whole mammogram process.

 

159

00:07:37,760 –> 00:07:41,880

Glad I never have to do that again, because my gosh, mammograms are terrible.

 

160

00:07:41,880 –> 00:07:44,120

And I like so painful.

 

161

00:07:44,120 –> 00:07:46,640

I was just talking about this with somebody yesterday.

 

162

00:07:46,640 –> 00:07:49,920

Like I’m so glad I was a one and done mammogram participant.

 

163

00:07:49,920 –> 00:07:50,920

For real.

 

164

00:07:50,920 –> 00:07:51,920

I’m so glad.

 

165

00:07:51,920 –> 00:07:54,920

Yeah, I have PTSD thinking about it.

 

166

00:07:54,920 –> 00:07:57,000

Oh, yeah.

 

167

00:07:57,000 –> 00:08:00,600

And so I had the biopsy like a day or two after that.

 

168

00:08:00,600 –> 00:08:01,600

It was on a Friday.

 

169

00:08:01,600 –> 00:08:04,720

I remember that because I had to wait the weekend to get my results.

 

170

00:08:04,720 –> 00:08:07,360

And they were like, oh, we’re going to see you on Tuesday.

 

171

00:08:07,360 –> 00:08:13,600

And I get a call on a Monday and they’re like, hey, we’d really like to see you today.

 

172

00:08:13,600 –> 00:08:14,600

Whenever you can come in.

 

173

00:08:14,600 –> 00:08:15,600

Yeah.

 

174

00:08:15,600 –> 00:08:16,600

You’re the VIP.

 

175

00:08:16,600 –> 00:08:19,720

Like literally this language where I’m like, fuck, I have cancer.

 

176

00:08:19,720 –> 00:08:23,640

And the moment they called and my parents had gone to work that day because they thought,

 

177

00:08:23,640 –> 00:08:25,120

oh, you’re it was summer.

 

178

00:08:25,120 –> 00:08:28,440

So I was at my parents’ house and, you know, we’ll be fine and we’ll go tomorrow to the

 

179

00:08:28,440 –> 00:08:29,560

doctor.

 

180

00:08:29,560 –> 00:08:31,040

And I call them and I say, you need to come home.

 

181

00:08:31,040 –> 00:08:33,000

We need to go to the doctor.

 

182

00:08:33,000 –> 00:08:37,160

And the moment I got that call, I actually got a call from my gynecologist office and

 

183

00:08:37,160 –> 00:08:40,680

they called me about support groups, which nothing had been official.

 

184

00:08:40,680 –> 00:08:42,680

Yeah, I don’t think there was anything like they didn’t know.

 

185

00:08:42,680 –> 00:08:45,240

They just wanted to make sure I had support, I think.

 

186

00:08:45,240 –> 00:08:48,120

But that was the moment I somehow knew.

 

187

00:08:48,120 –> 00:08:49,120

And I dropped.

 

188

00:08:49,120 –> 00:08:51,800

I think in a movie, I tell people this all the time, like it was in a like I dropped

 

189

00:08:51,800 –> 00:08:57,200

the phone and I started screaming like I and I when I say I screamed like it was a visceral

 

190

00:08:57,200 –> 00:08:59,240

reaction of what is happening.

 

191

00:08:59,240 –> 00:09:03,360

Like I literally went into some sort of fused state of screaming and my sister was home.

 

192

00:09:03,360 –> 00:09:06,080

She’s 19 and she literally was like, are you okay?

 

193

00:09:06,080 –> 00:09:07,200

Like she didn’t know what to do.

 

194

00:09:07,200 –> 00:09:09,600

She’s like, are you like what’s happening?

 

195

00:09:09,600 –> 00:09:11,480

And you know, then I calmed down.

 

196

00:09:11,480 –> 00:09:13,120

I explained what was happening.

 

197

00:09:13,120 –> 00:09:19,040

And by the time we got to the breast surgeon’s office and she told me, she’s like, okay,

 

198

00:09:19,040 –> 00:09:23,400

you know, you have DCIS, which is what they I was initially diagnosed as.

 

199

00:09:23,400 –> 00:09:24,400

And I was really stoic.

 

200

00:09:24,400 –> 00:09:25,400

My mom’s crying.

 

201

00:09:25,400 –> 00:09:27,840

And I’m like, all right, so we’re going to take them both.

 

202

00:09:27,840 –> 00:09:28,840

Let’s do it.

 

203

00:09:28,840 –> 00:09:30,920

And she was like, oh, okay.

 

204

00:09:30,920 –> 00:09:34,240

But I think I had like had the the visceral reaction prior.

 

205

00:09:34,240 –> 00:09:38,000

So I was very like, okay, put on the game face kind of thing.

 

206

00:09:38,000 –> 00:09:40,160

Yeah, like survival mode kicked in.

 

207

00:09:40,160 –> 00:09:41,760

Like, now what?

 

208

00:09:41,760 –> 00:09:42,760

What’s next?

 

209

00:09:42,760 –> 00:09:43,760

Yeah, yep.

 

210

00:09:43,760 –> 00:09:44,760

Exactly.

 

211

00:09:44,760 –> 00:09:48,600

And so yeah, so I chose to have a bilateral mastectomy since I was small chested to begin

 

212

00:09:48,600 –> 00:09:50,760

with after surgery.

 

213

00:09:50,760 –> 00:09:53,920

They got clear margins, but my lymph nodes came back as partially positive.

 

214

00:09:53,920 –> 00:09:55,880

And so I had to do chemotherapy.

 

215

00:09:55,880 –> 00:09:58,880

So I didn’t have to do radiation, but I did have to do chemotherapy.

 

216

00:09:58,880 –> 00:10:03,560

And I did go for a second opinion at Dana-Farber to see if like I qualified for any clinical

 

217

00:10:03,560 –> 00:10:05,960

trials, all that kind of jazz.

 

218

00:10:05,960 –> 00:10:09,480

At the time there was none because I was pretty like, I don’t want to say a standard case

 

219

00:10:09,480 –> 00:10:14,560

because of my age, I wasn’t but because of the profile, right?

 

220

00:10:14,560 –> 00:10:18,200

I was ER positive, PR positive, HER2 negative.

 

221

00:10:18,200 –> 00:10:21,520

And highly of the other two, like really high of PR and PR positive.

 

222

00:10:21,520 –> 00:10:26,280

So they were kind of like, well, we’re really just going to recommend ACT, so Adromycin

 

223

00:10:26,280 –> 00:10:28,320

Cytoxin and the Taxol.

 

224

00:10:28,320 –> 00:10:31,800

And so because it was pretty standard and there was no clinical trials for me at the

 

225

00:10:31,800 –> 00:10:33,240

time, I said, you know what?

 

226

00:10:33,240 –> 00:10:37,120

I would rather just go to my local cancer center where, because my parents were going

 

227

00:10:37,120 –> 00:10:38,680

to help care for me through treatment.

 

228

00:10:38,680 –> 00:10:41,480

And I said, you know, this will just make things really easier for me.

 

229

00:10:41,480 –> 00:10:45,880

So I’m not worrying about like commuting to Boston by myself and just being by alone really

 

230

00:10:45,880 –> 00:10:47,640

was the deal.

 

231

00:10:47,640 –> 00:10:50,240

So I did that and I again, didn’t have radiation.

 

232

00:10:50,240 –> 00:10:56,800

So treatment wise, that was my main kind of deal in terms of initial diagnosis and active

 

233

00:10:56,800 –> 00:10:57,800

treatment.

 

234

00:10:57,800 –> 00:10:59,880

And then I was on Tamoxifen for seven years.

 

235

00:10:59,880 –> 00:11:01,940

How many rounds of chemo did you do?

 

236

00:11:01,940 –> 00:11:06,960

So I did Adromycin Cytoxin for four rounds bi-weekly and then I did Taxol for 12 weeks

 

237

00:11:06,960 –> 00:11:07,960

weekly.

 

238

00:11:07,960 –> 00:11:08,960

Okay.

 

239

00:11:08,960 –> 00:11:10,960

So you did 16 rounds like I did, yeah?

 

240

00:11:10,960 –> 00:11:11,960

Yep.

 

241

00:11:11,960 –> 00:11:12,960

Yep.

 

242

00:11:12,960 –> 00:11:15,280

Which is again, pretty standard for like that kind of profiles.

 

243

00:11:15,280 –> 00:11:19,320

But at the same time going into it, I had no one who had done chemotherapy.

 

244

00:11:19,320 –> 00:11:21,520

So I’m like, okay, I’m going to lose my hair and then what else?

 

245

00:11:21,520 –> 00:11:24,160

And no one tells you about all the other things you have to deal with when you’re going through

 

246

00:11:24,160 –> 00:11:25,160

chemotherapy.

 

247

00:11:25,160 –> 00:11:26,800

Like the new LASTA shots.

 

248

00:11:26,800 –> 00:11:29,760

My gosh, I still remember the pain from those new LASTA shots.

 

249

00:11:29,760 –> 00:11:32,280

I hate those so much.

 

250

00:11:32,280 –> 00:11:33,280

It’s terrible.

 

251

00:11:33,280 –> 00:11:34,280

Yeah.

 

252

00:11:34,280 –> 00:11:39,240

I have a clear memory of like laying in bed and my legs just throbbing because of the

 

253

00:11:39,240 –> 00:11:40,240

bone pain.

 

254

00:11:40,240 –> 00:11:41,240

It was terrible.

 

255

00:11:41,240 –> 00:11:44,840

I feel like I lived in an Epsom salt bath, at least 12 rounds.

 

256

00:11:44,840 –> 00:11:46,360

Oh yeah.

 

257

00:11:46,360 –> 00:11:49,440

So what stage were you?

 

258

00:11:49,440 –> 00:11:50,440

Oh yeah.

 

259

00:11:50,440 –> 00:11:51,440

Gosh, I didn’t even say that.

 

260

00:11:51,440 –> 00:11:52,520

So it was originally DCI, yeah.

 

261

00:11:52,520 –> 00:11:58,760

So stage zero, but then surgery with the involvement of my lymph nodes, it was stage 1B.

 

262

00:11:58,760 –> 00:12:02,760

Just because of the size of my tumor plus the lymph node involvement.

 

263

00:12:02,760 –> 00:12:03,760

Yeah.

 

264

00:12:03,760 –> 00:12:11,120

I think it’s incredible that you found it early and your doctor just said, hey, let’s

 

265

00:12:11,120 –> 00:12:12,680

just get it checked.

 

266

00:12:12,680 –> 00:12:17,440

Because if he dismissed that, then your stage could have been worse.

 

267

00:12:17,440 –> 00:12:18,440

Oh gosh, yeah.

 

268

00:12:18,440 –> 00:12:20,520

Well, and that’s not funny.

 

269

00:12:20,520 –> 00:12:24,080

It’s actually a sad story, but I distinctly remember.

 

270

00:12:24,080 –> 00:12:29,640

So my breast surgeon, after I had gotten my diagnosis, and she literally said, I’m really

 

271

00:12:29,640 –> 00:12:34,680

glad your doctor sent you for that ultrasound because other doctors would say, wait six

 

272

00:12:34,680 –> 00:12:36,680

months and come back.

 

273

00:12:36,680 –> 00:12:41,540

And she had literally had another patient who was 26, only a couple of years older than

 

274

00:12:41,540 –> 00:12:46,600

myself at the time, who had just been diagnosed stage four because the doctor had told her

 

275

00:12:46,600 –> 00:12:47,600

to wait.

 

276

00:12:47,600 –> 00:12:51,680

And that happens scarily more often than we like to believe.

 

277

00:12:51,680 –> 00:12:54,560

So that just gave me chills.

 

278

00:12:54,560 –> 00:12:59,800

Which is why I went back and thanked my doctor because I was literally like, thank you.

 

279

00:12:59,800 –> 00:13:03,360

Because if it wasn’t for you, I don’t think looking back now, it’s like, I wouldn’t have

 

280

00:13:03,360 –> 00:13:04,360

been Aaron.

 

281

00:13:04,360 –> 00:13:08,300

And again, he was someone who I wouldn’t necessarily classify someone who was like, oh, I’m going

 

282

00:13:08,300 –> 00:13:12,080

to do this and be an advocate for young women or anything.

 

283

00:13:12,080 –> 00:13:17,240

He was just kind of a chill older male gynecologist who was really sweet.

 

284

00:13:17,240 –> 00:13:18,640

And so yeah, really good doctor.

 

285

00:13:18,640 –> 00:13:20,720

I was really lucky in that regard.

 

286

00:13:20,720 –> 00:13:27,080

After you were diagnosed, I know that you were feeling very distraught and probably

 

287

00:13:27,080 –> 00:13:28,480

angry even.

 

288

00:13:28,480 –> 00:13:33,800

But did you do any further research or did you just slowly get your information from

 

289

00:13:33,800 –> 00:13:34,800

your doctors?

 

290

00:13:34,800 –> 00:13:35,800

Yeah.

 

291

00:13:35,800 –> 00:13:41,520

So I definitely did a lot of my own research, different forums, different research articles.

 

292

00:13:41,520 –> 00:13:43,520

Because as I said, I was in grad school.

 

293

00:13:43,520 –> 00:13:47,760

So I was that nerd who was literally reading medical journals and coming in and being like,

 

294

00:13:47,760 –> 00:13:49,160

oh, well, this is what the research said.

 

295

00:13:49,160 –> 00:13:50,160

And they were like, wait, you read that?

 

296

00:13:50,160 –> 00:13:52,720

And I was like, yes, I did.

 

297

00:13:52,720 –> 00:13:56,920

And so especially early on, I think as time has gone on, done less of that.

 

298

00:13:56,920 –> 00:14:00,340

I still keep up on things, but it’s to a lesser degree.

 

299

00:14:00,340 –> 00:14:05,160

But early on, I really dived in deep because it was the way I coped, really.

 

300

00:14:05,160 –> 00:14:06,160

That’s how I coped to.

 

301

00:14:06,160 –> 00:14:10,440

I need to know a lot of things.

 

302

00:14:10,440 –> 00:14:16,200

And I would ask more deeper questions just so I can kind of get a sense of like, is the

 

303

00:14:16,200 –> 00:14:21,280

oncologist or is the surgeon saying this because that’s just the protocol?

 

304

00:14:21,280 –> 00:14:26,240

Or did they really believe that in my case that this should be what it needs to be?

 

305

00:14:26,240 –> 00:14:27,240

Exactly.

 

306

00:14:27,240 –> 00:14:29,080

You just need to know everything too.

 

307

00:14:29,080 –> 00:14:34,840

I need to expect everything and I need to be fully informed before I go into a situation.

 

308

00:14:34,840 –> 00:14:37,160

In anything, whether it’s like cancer or anything.

 

309

00:14:37,160 –> 00:14:39,320

So I’m like that as well.

 

310

00:14:39,320 –> 00:14:41,440

But it’s also just like taking charge, right?

 

311

00:14:41,440 –> 00:14:43,560

Taking charge of your health.

 

312

00:14:43,560 –> 00:14:44,560

It’s a control piece.

 

313

00:14:44,560 –> 00:14:45,560

Yeah.

 

314

00:14:45,560 –> 00:14:48,000

And I think too, where so much feels out of control.

 

315

00:14:48,000 –> 00:14:50,560

So I talked about feeling overwhelmed and all of that and angry.

 

316

00:14:50,560 –> 00:14:53,160

And I think that was my way of taking control.

 

317

00:14:53,160 –> 00:14:56,040

Well, one of the ways is, okay, you know what?

 

318

00:14:56,040 –> 00:15:00,840

I can’t change what’s happening, but I can change the fact that I have knowledge about

 

319

00:15:00,840 –> 00:15:03,240

it and better inform myself.

 

320

00:15:03,240 –> 00:15:05,320

And to me, that was helpful.

 

321

00:15:05,320 –> 00:15:06,320

Yeah.

 

322

00:15:06,320 –> 00:15:14,440

And I mean, when I was 23, I felt like a naive person at that age.

 

323

00:15:14,440 –> 00:15:20,640

And I’m sure there’s just a lot of women who probably felt that way too.

 

324

00:15:20,640 –> 00:15:26,920

But I’m so glad that you’ve just mentioned that you just took action because there should

 

325

00:15:26,920 –> 00:15:31,160

be more young women to say like, no, I don’t agree with this.

 

326

00:15:31,160 –> 00:15:36,160

Or no, I want to get it checked out.

 

327

00:15:36,160 –> 00:15:42,240

Something is unusual and I disagree that we should wait six months.

 

328

00:15:42,240 –> 00:15:47,280

I think we should advocate more for sure.

 

329

00:15:47,280 –> 00:15:52,840

And also normalize the fact too really quickly that if my doctor had told me that day, go

 

330

00:15:52,840 –> 00:15:54,280

home, I’ll see you in six months.

 

331

00:15:54,280 –> 00:15:57,440

Or if it gets worse, I would have went home, peace of mind.

 

332

00:15:57,440 –> 00:16:04,800

So I want to normalize that too because I think I had a lot of more implicit faith and

 

333

00:16:04,800 –> 00:16:10,200

trust in my doctors because you don’t know better until you know.

 

334

00:16:10,200 –> 00:16:11,600

And if you know, you know kind of thing.

 

335

00:16:11,600 –> 00:16:13,520

And so I didn’t know.

 

336

00:16:13,520 –> 00:16:16,760

And I think I would have left that day feeling okay about that.

 

337

00:16:16,760 –> 00:16:20,400

And again, now I wouldn’t be that person.

 

338

00:16:20,400 –> 00:16:25,240

But also normalizing if someone ends up being that person and then they find out something

 

339

00:16:25,240 –> 00:16:28,160

later on, that’s also like that happens.

 

340

00:16:28,160 –> 00:16:30,320

And you can’t blame yourself either.

 

341

00:16:30,320 –> 00:16:35,800

What we can do is also teach doctors to be more informed that this happens in young women.

 

342

00:16:35,800 –> 00:16:39,040

And so just kind of normalizing that from the patient end of things, because I think

 

343

00:16:39,040 –> 00:16:43,880

sometimes it’s like we can advocate for ourselves and that we should 100% advocate for ourselves.

 

344

00:16:43,880 –> 00:16:47,600

And then also if we don’t have the tools to do so, our doctors should be the ones advocating

 

345

00:16:47,600 –> 00:16:48,600

for us.

 

346

00:16:48,600 –> 00:16:50,800

Yeah, like you said, like you went in, like that’s a medical professional.

 

347

00:16:50,800 –> 00:16:55,960

Somebody who like went to school had got the education to kind of tell me what’s going

 

348

00:16:55,960 –> 00:16:56,960

on in my body.

 

349

00:16:56,960 –> 00:17:01,040

So yeah, I would have left their peace of mind trusting that, you know, like I did what

 

350

00:17:01,040 –> 00:17:02,160

I was supposed to do.

 

351

00:17:02,160 –> 00:17:06,720

I went, I got this checked out and for somebody to tell me, yeah, like see you in six months,

 

352

00:17:06,720 –> 00:17:08,300

I’d be like, yeah, see you in six months.

 

353

00:17:08,300 –> 00:17:13,160

And I also wanting to believe that this isn’t like something so serious.

 

354

00:17:13,160 –> 00:17:19,840

So I know that you mentioned that, you know, at 23, you were starting graduate school.

 

355

00:17:19,840 –> 00:17:26,200

At that time in the financial aspect of things, were you still financially dependent on your

 

356

00:17:26,200 –> 00:17:31,880

parents or were you able to find like a job and get health insurance to your employment?

 

357

00:17:31,880 –> 00:17:33,240

Just walk us through that.

 

358

00:17:33,240 –> 00:17:34,240

Yeah.

 

359

00:17:34,240 –> 00:17:37,240

So I want to say, I always tell them like, I want to say I was lucky, but I’m thankful

 

360

00:17:37,240 –> 00:17:41,520

that I was in graduate school at the time because of the fact that since I was still

 

361

00:17:41,520 –> 00:17:47,000

a student under Obamacare, I was able to be insured under my parents, even though, because

 

362

00:17:47,000 –> 00:17:48,000

I was a student.

 

363

00:17:48,000 –> 00:17:52,640

I had a part-time position, like I was like all my bills and things, like I paid myself.

 

364

00:17:52,640 –> 00:17:55,880

But in terms of health insurance, that was still through my parents because I was able

 

365

00:17:55,880 –> 00:17:57,680

to have that till I was 26.

 

366

00:17:57,680 –> 00:18:01,240

It was amazing because my mom worked at the time.

 

367

00:18:01,240 –> 00:18:04,520

Since I was a kid, she’s worked in admin assistant roles in education.

 

368

00:18:04,520 –> 00:18:09,040

And so she worked at that time for a middle school and her health insurance was amazing

 

369

00:18:09,040 –> 00:18:10,860

through the state of Connecticut.

 

370

00:18:10,860 –> 00:18:14,520

And so I didn’t have the medical bills that other people were having.

 

371

00:18:14,520 –> 00:18:20,280

So I didn’t have to go through the GoFundMe or those kind of things because I felt like

 

372

00:18:20,280 –> 00:18:22,960

I was in a place where I didn’t have that.

 

373

00:18:22,960 –> 00:18:28,400

I did and I do have student loans, but I didn’t have that plus medical bills.

 

374

00:18:28,400 –> 00:18:31,780

And so I’m really thankful that I was in that place because of it.

 

375

00:18:31,780 –> 00:18:33,360

But then there’s that, where’s that weird transition?

 

376

00:18:33,360 –> 00:18:37,560

When I turned 26 and I said, okay, now I’m on not so good graduate student insurance.

 

377

00:18:37,560 –> 00:18:42,040

I hope I don’t get sick again over these next whatever the time period until I get

 

378

00:18:42,040 –> 00:18:44,080

employed and finish my degree.

 

379

00:18:44,080 –> 00:18:49,040

I was lucky that wasn’t the case, but that was a concern I had for quite some time during

 

380

00:18:49,040 –> 00:18:50,840

that, any time I had health concerns.

 

381

00:18:50,840 –> 00:18:51,840

Yeah, of course.

 

382

00:18:51,840 –> 00:18:57,960

I mean, after a cancer diagnosis, you’re like, anything can happen.

 

383

00:18:57,960 –> 00:18:58,960

Yeah.

 

384

00:18:58,960 –> 00:19:06,320

Well, that and making decisions based off health insurance.

 

385

00:19:06,320 –> 00:19:11,920

Having to do things like get a domestic partnership like what I did in order to get my partner’s

 

386

00:19:11,920 –> 00:19:13,720

really good health insurance and things like that.

 

387

00:19:13,720 –> 00:19:15,560

You start making those decisions.

 

388

00:19:15,560 –> 00:19:16,840

And just to kind of relate to that.

 

389

00:19:16,840 –> 00:19:20,600

So when I turned, when I finished my PhD, I was going on the job market.

 

390

00:19:20,600 –> 00:19:23,440

And at the time I was like not sure if I was going to have a job.

 

391

00:19:23,440 –> 00:19:25,440

And so I wasn’t going to have health insurance.

 

392

00:19:25,440 –> 00:19:28,440

And so my partner and I had gotten engaged.

 

393

00:19:28,440 –> 00:19:33,520

Him and I had gotten engaged like six months prior and we actually moved, like we got married

 

394

00:19:33,520 –> 00:19:36,000

sooner because we wanted to make sure I had health insurance.

 

395

00:19:36,000 –> 00:19:37,400

Everyone was like, oh, are you pregnant?

 

396

00:19:37,400 –> 00:19:39,960

I’m like, no, I need health insurance.

 

397

00:19:39,960 –> 00:19:43,520

And he understands that and wants to make sure I’m cared for.

 

398

00:19:43,520 –> 00:19:46,680

And so we got married a little bit earlier to ensure that I was insured.

 

399

00:19:46,680 –> 00:19:50,320

Although I worked out, I ended up getting a position where I got better health insurance

 

400

00:19:50,320 –> 00:19:52,600

shortly after that, but we didn’t know that.

 

401

00:19:52,600 –> 00:19:58,080

And so we made sure I was in a place where I was always insured because that was a concern.

 

402

00:19:58,080 –> 00:20:00,960

Your husband, was he with you when you were, when you were you guys together, when you

 

403

00:20:00,960 –> 00:20:01,960

were diagnosed?

 

404

00:20:01,960 –> 00:20:02,960

No.

 

405

00:20:02,960 –> 00:20:08,040

So I was, I was in a relationship, but you know, that part and I just didn’t work out.

 

406

00:20:08,040 –> 00:20:11,960

And so I had met him actually shortly after I had finished chemotherapy.

 

407

00:20:11,960 –> 00:20:14,320

So he had actually met me with like my hair wrap and everything.

 

408

00:20:14,320 –> 00:20:18,680

He was on an interview for our PhD program and that’s where we met.

 

409

00:20:18,680 –> 00:20:22,280

And then we became acquainted shortly after and probably dated like a year after that.

 

410

00:20:22,280 –> 00:20:26,080

But yeah, so I, he’s known me only with my scars only.

 

411

00:20:26,080 –> 00:20:31,440

I had the note about that at some point through this, but I’ll maybe bring it up later.

 

412

00:20:31,440 –> 00:20:38,400

You know, we had a conversation, a Zoom meeting together prior to recording this episode.

 

413

00:20:38,400 –> 00:20:44,020

And you mentioned that while you were going through chemotherapy, you still continued

 

414

00:20:44,020 –> 00:20:45,920

your graduate program.

 

415

00:20:45,920 –> 00:20:52,520

Can you tell the listeners like, how did you have the strength to continue that?

 

416

00:20:52,520 –> 00:20:54,660

For me, I really needed something to focus on.

 

417

00:20:54,660 –> 00:20:58,680

So the month between, so I was diagnosed July 30th, 2012.

 

418

00:20:58,680 –> 00:21:02,720

I had surgery August 8th, and then I was recovering from surgery.

 

419

00:21:02,720 –> 00:21:07,360

And I will tell you, during that time, I just, I was like ruminating a lot, like right of

 

420

00:21:07,360 –> 00:21:08,920

everything I was dealing with.

 

421

00:21:08,920 –> 00:21:14,320

And I just felt like, and I didn’t have an outlet because I didn’t know anyone my age.

 

422

00:21:14,320 –> 00:21:18,000

So I really didn’t have an outlet of like support in that way.

 

423

00:21:18,000 –> 00:21:23,380

And so I felt like continuing my education gave me something to focus on.

 

424

00:21:23,380 –> 00:21:26,120

It’s also just very on brand for me as a person.

 

425

00:21:26,120 –> 00:21:29,400

I’m very much a person who kind of goes, goes, goes.

 

426

00:21:29,400 –> 00:21:34,360

I’ve slowed down in more recent years as I’ve reflected on the importance of rest.

 

427

00:21:34,360 –> 00:21:40,040

But when I was 23, that was not a thing I prioritize, which most 23 year olds don’t.

 

428

00:21:40,040 –> 00:21:41,040

It was helpful.

 

429

00:21:41,040 –> 00:21:43,240

It was a focus point for me.

 

430

00:21:43,240 –> 00:21:46,040

And so I think the downtime was harder.

 

431

00:21:46,040 –> 00:21:51,440

And so school really gave me an outlet to focus because besides my family, I was really,

 

432

00:21:51,440 –> 00:21:53,960

felt really alone through the experience.

 

433

00:21:53,960 –> 00:21:59,180

Did you get any like assistance from your university or college professors?

 

434

00:21:59,180 –> 00:22:04,600

I’m just wondering if like they, I don’t know, like understood what you’re going through

 

435

00:22:04,600 –> 00:22:08,000

or if you mentioned to them that you’re going through chemotherapy.

 

436

00:22:08,000 –> 00:22:09,000

Yeah.

 

437

00:22:09,000 –> 00:22:14,560

So it was really interesting because my department specifically, there was actually several cancer

 

438

00:22:14,560 –> 00:22:17,400

survivor like breast cancer survivors in that department.

 

439

00:22:17,400 –> 00:22:21,080

It was just, it was actually this like whole thing, but either way they, there were several

 

440

00:22:21,080 –> 00:22:22,080

of them.

 

441

00:22:22,080 –> 00:22:23,080

So they were really supportive.

 

442

00:22:23,080 –> 00:22:27,240

And my specifically, my mentor, my, what we call my major professor, the person who like

 

443

00:22:27,240 –> 00:22:30,720

guided me through grad school was really supportive.

 

444

00:22:30,720 –> 00:22:34,080

You know, he actually encouraged me to take a year off and I said, no, that’s not going

 

445

00:22:34,080 –> 00:22:35,080

to work for me.

 

446

00:22:35,080 –> 00:22:39,920

And he wasn’t too surprised knowing who I am, but instead I scaled back.

 

447

00:22:39,920 –> 00:22:46,260

As I said, I took two classes instead of like three or four and I scaled back my teaching.

 

448

00:22:46,260 –> 00:22:49,340

So I made my schedule Tuesdays, the Thursdays.

 

449

00:22:49,340 –> 00:22:52,440

So I kept my schedule really constrained where I had to be on campus.

 

450

00:22:52,440 –> 00:22:54,380

Cause again, this was pre COVID time.

 

451

00:22:54,380 –> 00:22:58,240

So you weren’t like the working from home thing was just not a normalized thing you

 

452

00:22:58,240 –> 00:22:59,440

were doing.

 

453

00:22:59,440 –> 00:23:04,640

And so Tuesdays and Thursdays I would be on campus taking classes at my like grad school

 

454

00:23:04,640 –> 00:23:05,640

apartment.

 

455

00:23:05,640 –> 00:23:10,080

I would actually, cause I wanted to be able to take, be cared for during like after a

 

456

00:23:10,080 –> 00:23:11,080

post chemo.

 

457

00:23:11,080 –> 00:23:17,560

So I would go home to Connecticut on Friday mornings, get treatment that like afternoon.

 

458

00:23:17,560 –> 00:23:20,640

And then I would spend the weekend with my family and go back to school, up to school

 

459

00:23:20,640 –> 00:23:25,680

on Mondays in Rhode Island and then continue that process again and again for the 20 weeks

 

460

00:23:25,680 –> 00:23:27,040

or whatever.

 

461

00:23:27,040 –> 00:23:32,120

And so yeah, it was a lot, but you know.

 

462

00:23:32,120 –> 00:23:36,040

Like at first it sounded like you gave yourself grace, but then at the end it did sound like

 

463

00:23:36,040 –> 00:23:37,040

it was a lot.

 

464

00:23:37,040 –> 00:23:40,440

So did you feel like it was in between or did you have to adjust?

 

465

00:23:40,440 –> 00:23:42,680

Yeah, I think there, it was hard.

 

466

00:23:42,680 –> 00:23:45,640

Like there were days where I should have been kinder to myself.

 

467

00:23:45,640 –> 00:23:47,000

Like I think in hindsight, right?

 

468

00:23:47,000 –> 00:23:48,000

Hindsight is 2020.

 

469

00:23:48,000 –> 00:23:52,480

So looking back, I’m like, wow, I know I should have been kinder to my 23 year old self, but

 

470

00:23:52,480 –> 00:23:54,360

I didn’t really know better.

 

471

00:23:54,360 –> 00:23:58,260

And there was a time where I kind of lauded myself for saying, I never missed a class.

 

472

00:23:58,260 –> 00:24:02,240

And I looked back and I’m like, that’s, you probably should have missed it.

 

473

00:24:02,240 –> 00:24:03,240

Okay.

 

474

00:24:03,240 –> 00:24:05,000

Everyone would have been fine if you missed the class.

 

475

00:24:05,000 –> 00:24:10,760

But I remember because there was one day where I, I tried to stay away from caffeine during

 

476

00:24:10,760 –> 00:24:16,200

treatment and you know, my nurse practitioner was like, you know, if you need a coffee once

 

477

00:24:16,200 –> 00:24:19,480

in a while, it’s fine, but you really should try to like minimize your caffeine intake.

 

478

00:24:19,480 –> 00:24:20,920

And I said, cool.

 

479

00:24:20,920 –> 00:24:24,280

And I remember this one day and I kind of like, was like, oh, I need a latte.

 

480

00:24:24,280 –> 00:24:27,400

I’m not going to make it through this three hour class if I don’t have this latte.

 

481

00:24:27,400 –> 00:24:30,080

And it was like, it tasted like liquid gold that day.

 

482

00:24:30,080 –> 00:24:31,080

Yeah.

 

483

00:24:31,080 –> 00:24:34,640

I just like really needed it.

 

484

00:24:34,640 –> 00:24:38,200

But I think a lot of it was like, I brought just like a lot of snacks and I, you know,

 

485

00:24:38,200 –> 00:24:39,200

again, we weren’t massed.

 

486

00:24:39,200 –> 00:24:43,120

So I was just sitting there with like grapes or something, just trying to like stay awake.

 

487

00:24:43,120 –> 00:24:44,120

Right.

 

488

00:24:44,120 –> 00:24:47,200

And people were understanding and I think people were actually more understanding than

 

489

00:24:47,200 –> 00:24:49,480

I think I was to myself during a lot of that.

 

490

00:24:49,480 –> 00:24:53,160

Because again, when you’re young, you expect yourself to be doing a lot and kind of going

 

491

00:24:53,160 –> 00:24:57,320

and, and I was, I don’t, I think I could have just been kinder to myself.

 

492

00:24:57,320 –> 00:25:00,400

But again, I, you know better now as time goes by.

 

493

00:25:00,400 –> 00:25:01,400

Yeah.

 

494

00:25:01,400 –> 00:25:02,400

Yeah, exactly.

 

495

00:25:02,400 –> 00:25:07,600

Did you keep your breast cancer journey private or were you open about your story with your

 

496

00:25:07,600 –> 00:25:11,520

family and friends or like people in college?

 

497

00:25:11,520 –> 00:25:16,360

When I was diagnosed, like I tried wigs and I looked ridiculous in them friends.

 

498

00:25:16,360 –> 00:25:21,960

Like I looked like, I think it’s just because I had like, I especially pre chemo, like I

 

499

00:25:21,960 –> 00:25:24,680

had a really petite face, like, you know, and all of that.

 

500

00:25:24,680 –> 00:25:26,640

And I just, it did not work.

 

501

00:25:26,640 –> 00:25:29,680

And so I did the caps and I did the wraps and I did all those things because it was

 

502

00:25:29,680 –> 00:25:32,280

winter when I was going through a majority of my treatment.

 

503

00:25:32,280 –> 00:25:36,920

So I needed that, but there was no way I was hiding this pretty much.

 

504

00:25:36,920 –> 00:25:38,560

Like people were going to know something was up.

 

505

00:25:38,560 –> 00:25:44,400

And so I was pretty open about it and I said to myself, it was kind of a self conversation

 

506

00:25:44,400 –> 00:25:45,400

at the start.

 

507

00:25:45,400 –> 00:25:50,880

And I said, you’re not going to be ashamed of this because you shouldn’t be, and you’re

 

508

00:25:50,880 –> 00:25:54,920

going to be open about it to the extent that you feel comfortable being open about it.

 

509

00:25:54,920 –> 00:25:57,600

And so, you know, I did tell people, Hey, I’m going through treatment.

 

510

00:25:57,600 –> 00:25:58,600

This is what’s happening.

 

511

00:25:58,600 –> 00:26:02,560

And it’s really funny because, and I know this will tie into the next piece we want

 

512

00:26:02,560 –> 00:26:06,760

to talk about, but you know, Instagram was like, just became a thing in 2012.

 

513

00:26:06,760 –> 00:26:09,000

And so a lot of my sharing was really on Facebook.

 

514

00:26:09,000 –> 00:26:11,940

And so of course now Facebook has those Facebook memories.

 

515

00:26:11,940 –> 00:26:17,240

And so those things will pop up where, and it’s just like me like venting about how like

 

516

00:26:17,240 –> 00:26:21,360

chemo sucks and the new last of pain and that I’m tired.

 

517

00:26:21,360 –> 00:26:26,440

And so I did share those things because I wanted to normalize it, especially during

 

518

00:26:26,440 –> 00:26:27,440

treatment.

 

519

00:26:27,440 –> 00:26:31,760

And it was partly because I didn’t also want to have to call family or friends to like

 

520

00:26:31,760 –> 00:26:33,400

keep everyone in the loop.

 

521

00:26:33,400 –> 00:26:38,120

And you know, I was, I didn’t have the capacity for like a caring bridge or whatever, you

 

522

00:26:38,120 –> 00:26:40,760

know, sort of site thing to like update people.

 

523

00:26:40,760 –> 00:26:43,200

And so I was kind of like, you can check my Facebook.

 

524

00:26:43,200 –> 00:26:46,860

This is where I think about my life and the venting and things.

 

525

00:26:46,860 –> 00:26:51,560

And so I did, I was pretty open about it, but I also, I think during treatment, I was

 

526

00:26:51,560 –> 00:26:56,760

more open than post-treatment about how difficult it was.

 

527

00:26:56,760 –> 00:27:00,800

Just because I think it’s easy because people see you and they, they’re, you’re bald and

 

528

00:27:00,800 –> 00:27:02,040

you’re like, yeah, this is hard.

 

529

00:27:02,040 –> 00:27:05,400

And they’re like, oh yeah, it must be hard because they see you as bald.

 

530

00:27:05,400 –> 00:27:09,240

But once your hair starts to grow back and everyone’s like, you’re fine.

 

531

00:27:09,240 –> 00:27:10,240

Must be great now.

 

532

00:27:10,240 –> 00:27:11,240

Yay.

 

533

00:27:11,240 –> 00:27:14,480

And you’re like, no, that’s not how this works.

 

534

00:27:14,480 –> 00:27:15,480

But okay.

 

535

00:27:15,480 –> 00:27:18,800

And so you stop telling people because you feel like you’re, especially early on, I felt

 

536

00:27:18,800 –> 00:27:23,240

like I was burdening people by bringing it up when again, I was struggling for quite

 

537

00:27:23,240 –> 00:27:24,240

some time.

 

538

00:27:24,240 –> 00:27:30,800

So there was like a couple of things that you mentioned, like one, not being ashamed

 

539

00:27:30,800 –> 00:27:33,160

of what you’re going through.

 

540

00:27:33,160 –> 00:27:36,520

And I love that.

 

541

00:27:36,520 –> 00:27:41,480

Honestly, love that because like, if you don’t tell that to yourself, it’s just going to

 

542

00:27:41,480 –> 00:27:44,840

get even worse when you go through the process.

 

543

00:27:44,840 –> 00:27:48,680

Secondly, I mean about post-treatment, it’s so true.

 

544

00:27:48,680 –> 00:27:50,920

Like I’m currently going through that process.

 

545

00:27:50,920 –> 00:27:57,840

Shana is going through that process where we may look fine, but honestly, like with

 

546

00:27:57,840 –> 00:28:03,120

the medication and just the post-treatment fatigue and all that, you went through this

 

547

00:28:03,120 –> 00:28:06,400

like sprint of surgery, chemotherapy.

 

548

00:28:06,400 –> 00:28:14,400

I know you didn’t do radiation, but just like going through all of that and then your

 

549

00:28:14,400 –> 00:28:16,560

doctors say, okay, bye.

 

550

00:28:16,560 –> 00:28:17,560

See ya.

 

551

00:28:17,560 –> 00:28:19,080

And you’re like, oh shit.

 

552

00:28:19,080 –> 00:28:21,000

I don’t even know how to…

 

553

00:28:21,000 –> 00:28:22,000

Yeah.

 

554

00:28:22,000 –> 00:28:25,040

You feel like you’re dropped in the ocean and they’re like, okay, you’re going to drown

 

555

00:28:25,040 –> 00:28:26,040

now.

 

556

00:28:26,040 –> 00:28:27,040

Have fun.

 

557

00:28:27,040 –> 00:28:28,040

I love that.

 

558

00:28:28,040 –> 00:28:30,920

Like you’re literally on this beautiful like cruise ship through treatment where you’re

 

559

00:28:30,920 –> 00:28:33,120

held and supported.

 

560

00:28:33,120 –> 00:28:36,680

I literally had this like written down somewhere because I was like, that’s what it feels like

 

561

00:28:36,680 –> 00:28:40,040

like you’re on this like beautiful cruise ship of what do you need?

 

562

00:28:40,040 –> 00:28:41,280

How are you doing?

 

563

00:28:41,280 –> 00:28:42,280

What do you like?

 

564

00:28:42,280 –> 00:28:43,280

All of those things.

 

565

00:28:43,280 –> 00:28:47,720

And then the moment, I mean, it’s literally the moment they, they huck you overboard and

 

566

00:28:47,720 –> 00:28:49,520

they so say, figure it out.

 

567

00:28:49,520 –> 00:28:52,520

And you’re like, what do I figure out?

 

568

00:28:52,520 –> 00:28:53,800

How do I live my life?

 

569

00:28:53,800 –> 00:28:58,560

They’re not even giving me any sort of guidance of how do I live the rest?

 

570

00:28:58,560 –> 00:29:05,320

And that’s the hard part is it’s not, how do I live the next 20 years of my life?

 

571

00:29:05,320 –> 00:29:08,640

How do I live the next 40, 50, 60 years of my life?

 

572

00:29:08,640 –> 00:29:13,040

Because I’m 20 something when I’m diagnosed that I hope to live.

 

573

00:29:13,040 –> 00:29:15,760

And then it’s like, here’s this hormone blocking med.

 

574

00:29:15,760 –> 00:29:16,760

Take it.

 

575

00:29:16,760 –> 00:29:17,760

These are the symptoms.

 

576

00:29:17,760 –> 00:29:20,000

There’s not really much else we could do.

 

577

00:29:20,000 –> 00:29:21,000

Bye.

 

578

00:29:21,000 –> 00:29:26,160

And then you’re like, oh my God, now I have to like manage all of the symptoms and things

 

579

00:29:26,160 –> 00:29:28,020

that come with this.

 

580

00:29:28,020 –> 00:29:30,560

And there’s really like not a ton of support.

 

581

00:29:30,560 –> 00:29:33,760

And then there’s not enough to have conversation about what those symptoms look like.

 

582

00:29:33,760 –> 00:29:35,440

Like, yeah, they talk about the hot flashes.

 

583

00:29:35,440 –> 00:29:36,440

Sure.

 

584

00:29:36,440 –> 00:29:41,600

Hot flashes, some of the like sexual dysfunction stuff or whatever, you know, like I had nausea,

 

585

00:29:41,600 –> 00:29:47,560

I had joint pain, like all these things that were not really actively discussed with me.

 

586

00:29:47,560 –> 00:29:50,000

Like, Hey, this is going to happen, maybe.

 

587

00:29:50,000 –> 00:29:52,720

And are these the things that could happen to you?

 

588

00:29:52,720 –> 00:29:56,640

And so I was having these pains thinking, oh my gosh, is cancer back?

 

589

00:29:56,640 –> 00:29:57,640

Was this this?

 

590

00:29:57,640 –> 00:30:01,880

And it’s like a lot of that stuff ended up being symptoms because of tamoxifen.

 

591

00:30:01,880 –> 00:30:05,600

It’s the year of 2012 and you were told you had breast cancer.

 

592

00:30:05,600 –> 00:30:12,900

As an AYA, how were you able to find resources and support groups of young adult women with

 

593

00:30:12,900 –> 00:30:14,420

breast cancer?

 

594

00:30:14,420 –> 00:30:15,920

If there was any?

 

595

00:30:15,920 –> 00:30:16,920

Yeah.

 

596

00:30:16,920 –> 00:30:22,800

So a lot of the resources for me at the time largely consisted of people who didn’t really

 

597

00:30:22,800 –> 00:30:25,160

look like me, whether it was in person or online.

 

598

00:30:25,160 –> 00:30:30,280

So like I think about my cancer center, youngest one there didn’t see anyone remotely my age,

 

599

00:30:30,280 –> 00:30:31,880

even if it was a different cancer.

 

600

00:30:31,880 –> 00:30:35,840

I remember specifically going to like a feel good, look better, like event where, you know,

 

601

00:30:35,840 –> 00:30:39,400

they give you the makeup and you do the hair and like, or the hair, but the makeup stuff.

 

602

00:30:39,400 –> 00:30:42,320

And you’re like, oh, that’s going to be nice.

 

603

00:30:42,320 –> 00:30:48,760

And again, youngest, like by a little Hong shot there, even online, you know, I joined

 

604

00:30:48,760 –> 00:30:53,480

different breast cancer forums because that’s really where a lot of even Facebook groups

 

605

00:30:53,480 –> 00:30:55,720

weren’t as active as they are today.

 

606

00:30:55,720 –> 00:31:00,200

Like it’s, you know, it was really like breast cancer.org.

 

607

00:31:00,200 –> 00:31:03,440

Like there was different forums on there where you found yourself just like chatting with

 

608

00:31:03,440 –> 00:31:05,360

people late at night in these forums.

 

609

00:31:05,360 –> 00:31:07,520

And a lot of these women were much older than me.

 

610

00:31:07,520 –> 00:31:11,560

No one was really my age, but they, so they, a lot of them viewed me and they tell me that,

 

611

00:31:11,560 –> 00:31:14,360

you know, I’ve connected with, I’ve stayed connected with a lot of them over the years

 

612

00:31:14,360 –> 00:31:18,840

where, you know, I’m kind of their like cancer daughter, but I’m not, it’s not, it’s not

 

613

00:31:18,840 –> 00:31:23,800

a peer, you know, it’s, it’s someone who I look to in a different way.

 

614

00:31:23,800 –> 00:31:27,480

My mom did have a friend who worked for the American Cancer Society in Connecticut.

 

615

00:31:27,480 –> 00:31:31,520

And so she connected me with another young woman who was my age when I was diagnosed.

 

616

00:31:31,520 –> 00:31:37,040

And so we did stay connected through treatment and it was nice to have that person, but you

 

617

00:31:37,040 –> 00:31:41,000

know, she was, we were young, so we were both working and like, so I was a full time student

 

618

00:31:41,000 –> 00:31:45,520

and she was a full time like working because she hadn’t needed health insurance and trying,

 

619

00:31:45,520 –> 00:31:49,520

she was, she needed to do the GoFundMe’s and stuff because she needed money to pay for

 

620

00:31:49,520 –> 00:31:50,520

her bills.

 

621

00:31:50,520 –> 00:31:54,460

And so it was hard to stay connected because she was in Connecticut and I was in Rhode

 

622

00:31:54,460 –> 00:31:55,460

Island.

 

623

00:31:55,460 –> 00:32:01,160

So we had some connection, but it was, it was difficult to bond because, and also we

 

624

00:32:01,160 –> 00:32:02,560

are at different points in our treatment.

 

625

00:32:02,560 –> 00:32:07,160

So like today, I feel like you can find someone who is going through the exact same treatment

 

626

00:32:07,160 –> 00:32:11,360

plan at the exact time and doing pretty much the same things you’re doing and you can be

 

627

00:32:11,360 –> 00:32:15,360

like step, step by step together a lot of the time.

 

628

00:32:15,360 –> 00:32:16,920

And that just wasn’t the case.

 

629

00:32:16,920 –> 00:32:20,320

It was, but it was a good friendship to have at the time.

 

630

00:32:20,320 –> 00:32:22,560

But again, distance made it difficult.

 

631

00:32:22,560 –> 00:32:27,640

And so that was really before, you know, for many years, that was like my, the one person

 

632

00:32:27,640 –> 00:32:28,640

I had known.

 

633

00:32:28,640 –> 00:32:31,480

And then I went like many years, you know, a couple of years after that.

 

634

00:32:31,480 –> 00:32:34,760

And then, you know, I slowly started to connect to people.

 

635

00:32:34,760 –> 00:32:40,120

But at the time when I was going in active treatment, I was in it as we like to say in

 

636

00:32:40,120 –> 00:32:43,200

the cancer community, I really didn’t have like anyone.

 

637

00:32:43,200 –> 00:32:45,080

I was pretty, I was somewhat alone.

 

638

00:32:45,080 –> 00:32:49,360

I mean, for the most part, especially during the day to day, you know, it wasn’t someone

 

639

00:32:49,360 –> 00:32:54,280

I could text at like maybe three in the morning and say, I can’t sleep.

 

640

00:32:54,280 –> 00:32:56,280

It was just me.

 

641

00:32:56,280 –> 00:32:58,240

And I can’t even imagine.

 

642

00:32:58,240 –> 00:33:04,720

Like in the beginning, I felt like super alone, but then gradually with Instagram and then

 

643

00:33:04,720 –> 00:33:10,360

meeting Shana, I feel like I was able to connect more.

 

644

00:33:10,360 –> 00:33:16,960

And like, you know, back in 2012, it’s just, I feel like it’s probably super like difficult

 

645

00:33:16,960 –> 00:33:23,840

for you to go through this journey, technically like alone, essentially, because you were

 

646

00:33:23,840 –> 00:33:29,880

the only one in your age group, even though you like you met this other person.

 

647

00:33:29,880 –> 00:33:35,480

But, you know, you guys were just only connecting for like a short period of time.

 

648

00:33:35,480 –> 00:33:39,040

But what about the long term, you know?

 

649

00:33:39,040 –> 00:33:40,040

Exactly.

 

650

00:33:40,040 –> 00:33:46,720

We had got off our initial call and I just remember like texting Rosalina and being like,

 

651

00:33:46,720 –> 00:33:52,840

I cannot even imagine a being 23 because you and I are the same age.

 

652

00:33:52,840 –> 00:33:54,820

You know, like I was going to Rhode Island all the time.

 

653

00:33:54,820 –> 00:33:56,880

My best friend went to college, the same college you went to.

 

654

00:33:56,880 –> 00:34:01,640

And like, I remember like going there and just like, I don’t want to say reckless, but

 

655

00:34:01,640 –> 00:34:02,640

like just careless.

 

656

00:34:02,640 –> 00:34:04,600

Like I can just, you know, you feel you’re almost like invincible.

 

657

00:34:04,600 –> 00:34:07,880

Like you’re just going out and you have a good time and everyone’s like, you know, you’re

 

658

00:34:07,880 –> 00:34:11,040

dating and you’re like, just like, it’s just like a different life.

 

659

00:34:11,040 –> 00:34:17,000

I had a different life at 23 than I do, obviously now at 33, just like the carefreeness.

 

660

00:34:17,000 –> 00:34:21,080

And then, you know, like I remember being diagnosed and the first thing I did was hit

 

661

00:34:21,080 –> 00:34:28,040

Facebook groups and did a deep dive on Instagram trying to find like anything, like anything,

 

662

00:34:28,040 –> 00:34:34,480

you know, any type of support and like to have like none of those resources 10 years

 

663

00:34:34,480 –> 00:34:35,680

ago.

 

664

00:34:35,680 –> 00:34:39,680

Like I don’t know if I would have been able, I would have been able to even have gotten

 

665

00:34:39,680 –> 00:34:40,680

through that.

 

666

00:34:40,680 –> 00:34:44,340

Like I just, I literally, I thought about you actually after that call for like probably

 

667

00:34:44,340 –> 00:34:46,200

two hours after we had spoke.

 

668

00:34:46,200 –> 00:34:50,120

Like I just like couldn’t even, I think I texted, I texted Rosalina.

 

669

00:34:50,120 –> 00:34:55,400

I just, I can’t, I cannot even fathom at 23 and not, and not having the resources, especially

 

670

00:34:55,400 –> 00:34:56,400

we do now.

 

671

00:34:56,400 –> 00:34:59,840

I think too, it’s like, it was just, it’s not even, I think the resources are important.

 

672

00:34:59,840 –> 00:35:02,320

And then I also just think the models, right?

 

673

00:35:02,320 –> 00:35:06,520

Like in the sense that like there are now people, whether they’re influencers or not,

 

674

00:35:06,520 –> 00:35:12,680

like people that are now so vocal about the, the post treatment things.

 

675

00:35:12,680 –> 00:35:17,160

Like, I mean, when I’m, again, when I was in it, my head was down, your head is down

 

676

00:35:17,160 –> 00:35:18,160

through it, right?

 

677

00:35:18,160 –> 00:35:20,120

Like you’re just, you’re just going day to day.

 

678

00:35:20,120 –> 00:35:25,400

You’re just doing the thing because you don’t really have an option, but it’s when treatment

 

679

00:35:25,400 –> 00:35:32,040

ends and that moment like hits and you’re like, okay, well, I don’t look like any other

 

680

00:35:32,040 –> 00:35:33,960

23 year old.

 

681

00:35:33,960 –> 00:35:36,080

What is my life like now?

 

682

00:35:36,080 –> 00:35:37,840

And that was harder.

 

683

00:35:37,840 –> 00:35:43,680

I think that was when not having those types of like normalization of what it was like

 

684

00:35:43,680 –> 00:35:46,200

was what made it so hard for me.

 

685

00:35:46,200 –> 00:35:50,720

I think in it was, I don’t want to say it was easier, but I, you know, people say this

 

686

00:35:50,720 –> 00:35:52,720

all the time, right?

 

687

00:35:52,720 –> 00:35:55,040

During treatment is always going to be easier than post-treatment.

 

688

00:35:55,040 –> 00:35:56,720

And it’s true.

 

689

00:35:56,720 –> 00:36:01,880

Because when you’re in it, not only are you more held by your doctors, but you are also

 

690

00:36:01,880 –> 00:36:05,920

in a space where you are consistently doing something.

 

691

00:36:05,920 –> 00:36:10,160

You’re scheduling doctor’s appointments, you’re recovering from surgery, you’re recovering

 

692

00:36:10,160 –> 00:36:13,600

from chemo, radiation, et cetera, whatever you’re dealing with.

 

693

00:36:13,600 –> 00:36:19,680

But when you’re not in that, you just, you have time to kind of sit and reflect and say,

 

694

00:36:19,680 –> 00:36:21,800

what is my life going to look like?

 

695

00:36:21,800 –> 00:36:23,440

What does that mean for me?

 

696

00:36:23,440 –> 00:36:25,920

How has this changed everything?

 

697

00:36:25,920 –> 00:36:27,240

Like you said, you were so careless.

 

698

00:36:27,240 –> 00:36:31,400

You were so, I was, I think about myself two years prior to that, you know, when I was

 

699

00:36:31,400 –> 00:36:32,880

in my senior year of college.

 

700

00:36:32,880 –> 00:36:37,760

I mean, you know, you’re an idiot when you’re just doing stupid things and you’re having

 

701

00:36:37,760 –> 00:36:38,760

a good time.

 

702

00:36:38,760 –> 00:36:39,760

And exactly that’s, yeah.

 

703

00:36:39,760 –> 00:36:45,600

But the moment that like that, everything changed for me.

 

704

00:36:45,600 –> 00:36:50,680

I mean, I literally, my worldview stopped and said, well, how you saw the world and

 

705

00:36:50,680 –> 00:36:52,560

how you thought your life was going to look?

 

706

00:36:52,560 –> 00:36:53,560

Absolutely.

 

707

00:36:53,560 –> 00:36:54,560

100%.

 

708

00:36:54,560 –> 00:36:55,560

Yes.

 

709

00:36:55,560 –> 00:36:58,040

Now, now process that.

 

710

00:36:58,040 –> 00:37:05,160

Now like 10 years later, let’s just say, how has the breast cancer community changed over

 

711

00:37:05,160 –> 00:37:06,960

time?

 

712

00:37:06,960 –> 00:37:12,080

Did you think social media like hugely influenced women sharing their stories online, you know,

 

713

00:37:12,080 –> 00:37:13,720

especially in young women?

 

714

00:37:13,720 –> 00:37:17,760

Yeah, I have loved seeing the transformation of that.

 

715

00:37:17,760 –> 00:37:22,680

Like I, it’s beautiful watching people share their stories, myself included, like it just

 

716

00:37:22,680 –> 00:37:24,120

sharing the real truth of that.

 

717

00:37:24,120 –> 00:37:31,040

The hard truths of that is like you said, that cancer, particularly for us that are

 

718

00:37:31,040 –> 00:37:33,920

in the AYA space is fucking traumatic.

 

719

00:37:33,920 –> 00:37:34,920

It is a trauma.

 

720

00:37:34,920 –> 00:37:39,400

Like, let’s just like, and I tell people that all the time I’m like, this is not, oh, you

 

721

00:37:39,400 –> 00:37:41,400

went through something health wise and you’re over it.

 

722

00:37:41,400 –> 00:37:46,760

No, this is a trauma that you continue to have to sit and process and deal with forever.

 

723

00:37:46,760 –> 00:37:48,160

Like it’s just what it is.

 

724

00:37:48,160 –> 00:37:51,240

And it takes years of your life to process that.

 

725

00:37:51,240 –> 00:37:54,000

And it’s something that will always be with you in some sort of way.

 

726

00:37:54,000 –> 00:37:55,000

Yeah.

 

727

00:37:55,000 –> 00:37:58,120

I have loved seeing that because I love the normalization of that cult.

 

728

00:37:58,120 –> 00:38:02,380

Like I’m going to say culturally, because I don’t think culturally that has fully shifted,

 

729

00:38:02,380 –> 00:38:07,960

but I think the more we share our stories as AYA’s, the more we will see a shift in

 

730

00:38:07,960 –> 00:38:10,440

knowledge that people have about it.

 

731

00:38:10,440 –> 00:38:14,320

Because even I’ve had conversations with my own family members who were like, I thought

 

732

00:38:14,320 –> 00:38:16,520

you talked about cancer a lot for like too long.

 

733

00:38:16,520 –> 00:38:18,560

I thought that was only your only identity.

 

734

00:38:18,560 –> 00:38:24,960

And I’m like, no, I just want to bring awareness to the fact that this is hard and people need

 

735

00:38:24,960 –> 00:38:29,520

to understand that this is difficult and that we need to be supportive of the people in

 

736

00:38:29,520 –> 00:38:31,720

our life.

 

737

00:38:31,720 –> 00:38:37,640

So we have like our podcast page, but then I have my personal page where like I want

 

738

00:38:37,640 –> 00:38:45,680

it to be more about me and not about cancer because truthfully and honestly, I felt that

 

739

00:38:45,680 –> 00:38:50,880

if I talked about cancer too much, that people were just going to be, oh, here we go again,

 

740

00:38:50,880 –> 00:38:52,640

Rosalina talking about cancer.

 

741

00:38:52,640 –> 00:38:55,400

And so I just didn’t want that.

 

742

00:38:55,400 –> 00:38:58,120

Or I guess I didn’t want people to think that.

 

743

00:38:58,120 –> 00:39:00,080

And social media is one lens, right?

 

744

00:39:00,080 –> 00:39:03,440

So this was literally the reason I bring it up is because it was a recent conversation

 

745

00:39:03,440 –> 00:39:08,000

with a close family member of mine who, you know, and that we had a conversation and it

 

746

00:39:08,000 –> 00:39:12,240

wasn’t like my immediate family, but it was someone who had like tangentially kind of

 

747

00:39:12,240 –> 00:39:15,320

kept up with me through mostly social media through and stuff.

 

748

00:39:15,320 –> 00:39:18,800

And so they were like, you know, I shared so much about that and we thought that was

 

749

00:39:18,800 –> 00:39:19,840

only you.

 

750

00:39:19,840 –> 00:39:24,080

And I was like, but no, I’m like, that’s one piece of me.

 

751

00:39:24,080 –> 00:39:27,440

And that’s what I choose to share because I think it’s an important messaging to share.

 

752

00:39:27,440 –> 00:39:31,040

And I think it’s an important thing to normalize and share.

 

753

00:39:31,040 –> 00:39:36,800

So, you know, but I, and when I didn’t, there was a time where I did very much kind of what

 

754

00:39:36,800 –> 00:39:41,400

you did, where I had a page that I just shared about my life and I didn’t share really about

 

755

00:39:41,400 –> 00:39:42,400

cancer.

 

756

00:39:42,400 –> 00:39:46,160

And, but then I realized I wasn’t feeling authentic in that for me.

 

757

00:39:46,160 –> 00:39:49,160

And again, everyone has to make their choice around that, what they want to do with that.

 

758

00:39:49,160 –> 00:39:55,680

But for me, that didn’t feel authentic because my world was shaken when this happened to

 

759

00:39:55,680 –> 00:39:57,880

me at 23.

 

760

00:39:57,880 –> 00:40:02,720

Again it’s changed my whole trajectory of how I view things in my day to day in my life.

 

761

00:40:02,720 –> 00:40:05,720

I’m okay with that being a part of me.

 

762

00:40:05,720 –> 00:40:09,640

There was a time where I really resisted that and I kind of denied that piece of cancer

 

763

00:40:09,640 –> 00:40:12,880

because it was, you know, other people must wanted that for me.

 

764

00:40:12,880 –> 00:40:14,960

And I said, you know, no.

 

765

00:40:14,960 –> 00:40:19,200

And that was part of my, my processing of the trauma of saying, this is a part of me

 

766

00:40:19,200 –> 00:40:20,920

and that is okay.

 

767

00:40:20,920 –> 00:40:21,960

And that is okay.

 

768

00:40:21,960 –> 00:40:26,760

And so I have to normalize that, Hey, it’s okay that I have this and that I can talk

 

769

00:40:26,760 –> 00:40:27,760

about it.

 

770

00:40:27,760 –> 00:40:32,180

And then also there are all these other things about me as a person that make me wonderful,

 

771

00:40:32,180 –> 00:40:35,320

but this is also a part of me and that’s okay too.

 

772

00:40:35,320 –> 00:40:36,320

Yeah.

 

773

00:40:36,320 –> 00:40:42,560

Like I know that there is like a lot of women who are still very much afraid of sharing

 

774

00:40:42,560 –> 00:40:45,040

their story online.

 

775

00:40:45,040 –> 00:40:51,360

And if there is someone out there that knows what you’re going through and then went to

 

776

00:40:51,360 –> 00:40:57,120

see a doctor or like felt something unusual, they can come to you.

 

777

00:40:57,120 –> 00:41:02,920

And if they do, like, I think you just accomplished what you were trying to do in the first place

 

778

00:41:02,920 –> 00:41:04,240

of just raising awareness.

 

779

00:41:04,240 –> 00:41:05,240

Yep.

 

780

00:41:05,240 –> 00:41:06,720

I 100% agree.

 

781

00:41:06,720 –> 00:41:07,760

That ends up being the case.

 

782

00:41:07,760 –> 00:41:10,800

I don’t know how much that’s happened to both of you because you know, you’re finished the

 

783

00:41:10,800 –> 00:41:16,760

post-treatment phase and stuff, but over the years, I mean, the number of people, young

 

784

00:41:16,760 –> 00:41:21,800

people, people that are just cancer, you know, cancer survive, early cancer survivors.

 

785

00:41:21,800 –> 00:41:26,280

I’ve talked to over the years because I’m the only person that other people know as

 

786

00:41:26,280 –> 00:41:27,840

a cancer survivor in their life.

 

787

00:41:27,840 –> 00:41:31,000

So they’re like, Justine, please talk to this person.

 

788

00:41:31,000 –> 00:41:35,080

And I’m like, you know, of course I’m happy to do that, but it’s nice to be a resource

 

789

00:41:35,080 –> 00:41:36,180

in that way.

 

790

00:41:36,180 –> 00:41:42,000

And I think that this whole process, it sucks, but at least I feel like in that way I’m giving

 

791

00:41:42,000 –> 00:41:43,440

support to other people.

 

792

00:41:43,440 –> 00:41:47,120

And even, like you said, there’s ways to be supportive without necessarily sharing your

 

793

00:41:47,120 –> 00:41:48,120

story.

 

794

00:41:48,120 –> 00:41:49,840

And I think that’s okay too.

 

795

00:41:49,840 –> 00:41:53,680

And everyone has, again, I said this before, but everyone has to do what fits best for

 

796

00:41:53,680 –> 00:41:57,920

them because there were many years I didn’t share about my story publicly in any sort

 

797

00:41:57,920 –> 00:42:00,560

of forum because I didn’t feel safe.

 

798

00:42:00,560 –> 00:42:02,240

I didn’t feel like that made sense.

 

799

00:42:02,240 –> 00:42:04,200

There was a lot of reasons for me to do that.

 

800

00:42:04,200 –> 00:42:05,840

And I now feel in a different place.

 

801

00:42:05,840 –> 00:42:09,480

So you know, everyone, you know, you make those changes as time goes on too.

 

802

00:42:09,480 –> 00:42:10,480

Absolutely.

 

803

00:42:10,480 –> 00:42:14,000

I think even a simple, like, feel it on the first post every month, like it just, if that

 

804

00:42:14,000 –> 00:42:16,360

reminds one person to do a breast exam.

 

805

00:42:16,360 –> 00:42:20,480

You know, it doesn’t even have to be like where you’re sharing every aspect of your

 

806

00:42:20,480 –> 00:42:22,360

life and everything.

 

807

00:42:22,360 –> 00:42:25,400

It could just, like you said, like figuring out what it is that works for you, that one

 

808

00:42:25,400 –> 00:42:29,800

small post every month or anything that reminds somebody like, oh, check yourself.

 

809

00:42:29,800 –> 00:42:33,480

Like I’ve gotten so many messages, like random people too that follow me, like girls I went

 

810

00:42:33,480 –> 00:42:34,480

to college with.

 

811

00:42:34,480 –> 00:42:38,880

Like I had something going on and like you made me go want to go get it checked out and

 

812

00:42:38,880 –> 00:42:41,400

ended up being nothing but like, thank you.

 

813

00:42:41,400 –> 00:42:47,040

I would never have done it had I not seen that, A, this had happened to you and B, like

 

814

00:42:47,040 –> 00:42:49,880

posting about it, posting about doing breast exams, doing this, doing that.

 

815

00:42:49,880 –> 00:42:53,480

So it’s yeah, like just finding what it is, whatever it is that you’re comfortable enough

 

816

00:42:53,480 –> 00:42:57,040

to share about it, to bring awareness is important.

 

817

00:42:57,040 –> 00:42:58,600

And sometimes it’s just being yourself too.

 

818

00:42:58,600 –> 00:43:02,360

So you know, I just, I always want to normalize the sharing of in a way that makes sense for

 

819

00:43:02,360 –> 00:43:03,360

the person.

 

820

00:43:03,360 –> 00:43:05,640

And you know, it’s the same idea of when, you know, some people share their scars on

 

821

00:43:05,640 –> 00:43:10,520

their page and I don’t and I, you know, that that’s my like mind too, and that’s where

 

822

00:43:10,520 –> 00:43:12,040

I feel comfortable and that’s fine.

 

823

00:43:12,040 –> 00:43:13,040

Like, right.

 

824

00:43:13,040 –> 00:43:16,980

And so you do what feels comfortable and but that there’s ways to find that through the

 

825

00:43:16,980 –> 00:43:19,940

experience too for folks listening, you know.

 

826

00:43:19,940 –> 00:43:23,900

Let’s move on to your explant surgery that you had recently.

 

827

00:43:23,900 –> 00:43:29,200

You’ve had a double mastectomy and you had silicone implants for years.

 

828

00:43:29,200 –> 00:43:34,600

Most recently you shared a vulnerable post on Instagram, letting your followers know

 

829

00:43:34,600 –> 00:43:41,360

that you didn’t necessarily have a choice whether to go flat or continue to be in pain

 

830

00:43:41,360 –> 00:43:43,720

by keeping your silicone implants.

 

831

00:43:43,720 –> 00:43:49,560

What were the factors that helped you make that choice to go flat?

 

832

00:43:49,560 –> 00:43:51,080

It was something I thought about for a long time.

 

833

00:43:51,080 –> 00:43:56,720

I mean, Instagram was a big influence for me following people that were younger, not

 

834

00:43:56,720 –> 00:44:01,600

necessarily my age, but not much older than me sharing about like living flat, living

 

835

00:44:01,600 –> 00:44:06,280

flat out loud and that you can be beautiful while flat.

 

836

00:44:06,280 –> 00:44:10,760

It gave me a lot of confidence to do that because I was really, I hemmed and hawed about

 

837

00:44:10,760 –> 00:44:14,760

it for a long time, like over, you know, a couple of years of time.

 

838

00:44:14,760 –> 00:44:20,680

I had a revision in 2019 and when I had my implant, I had a capsular contracture, my

 

839

00:44:20,680 –> 00:44:21,680

implant flipped.

 

840

00:44:21,680 –> 00:44:26,080

Basically that was the moment where I said I was kind of a realization for me and I said,

 

841

00:44:26,080 –> 00:44:29,720

you know, if I have another issue with my implants, I’m going to take them out and I’m

 

842

00:44:29,720 –> 00:44:31,280

probably going to go flat.

 

843

00:44:31,280 –> 00:44:36,000

But then I developed shortly after I developed lymphedema and there was just all these different

 

844

00:44:36,000 –> 00:44:39,360

reasons for me that I said, you know, it was the lymphedema.

 

845

00:44:39,360 –> 00:44:43,280

It was the not wanting to be cut into more for me.

 

846

00:44:43,280 –> 00:44:47,720

I had, I’ve had a lot of surgeries, like different smaller procedures because of side effects

 

847

00:44:47,720 –> 00:44:51,480

and different things related to treatment, which, you know, we’ll go into the full details

 

848

00:44:51,480 –> 00:44:52,480

here.

 

849

00:44:52,480 –> 00:44:55,440

But that being said, I really just didn’t want to be cut into more.

 

850

00:44:55,440 –> 00:44:59,160

I’m tired is the best way for me to say it after 10 years, tired.

 

851

00:44:59,160 –> 00:45:00,680

And that’s kind of what it was for me.

 

852

00:45:00,680 –> 00:45:05,080

And so I didn’t want to go under the knife again and again and again.

 

853

00:45:05,080 –> 00:45:08,200

And to be honest, in the back of my mind, I always kind of think I knew this was something

 

854

00:45:08,200 –> 00:45:10,000

I would eventually do.

 

855

00:45:10,000 –> 00:45:11,280

I never tattooed my chest.

 

856

00:45:11,280 –> 00:45:13,240

I never got the nipple tattoos or anything like that.

 

857

00:45:13,240 –> 00:45:16,800

And doctors would ask me, I’d go for my, you know, see my oncologist, see my breast surgeon

 

858

00:45:16,800 –> 00:45:18,840

and they’d say, oh, are you going to do this?

 

859

00:45:18,840 –> 00:45:20,400

And I’m like, I don’t know.

 

860

00:45:20,400 –> 00:45:21,400

I don’t think so.

 

861

00:45:21,400 –> 00:45:22,400

I’m fine with them right.

 

862

00:45:22,400 –> 00:45:23,400

You know, the way it is right now.

 

863

00:45:23,400 –> 00:45:27,840

And I think because I knew at some point I would get rid of these implants and call it

 

864

00:45:27,840 –> 00:45:29,520

a day and call it quit.

 

865

00:45:29,520 –> 00:45:35,640

That wasn’t an option given to me when I was initially diagnosed, but it was still a difficult

 

866

00:45:35,640 –> 00:45:37,640

decision even when I made it.

 

867

00:45:37,640 –> 00:45:39,360

I thought about it for a long time.

 

868

00:45:39,360 –> 00:45:43,240

So this wasn’t something where, you know, I talk about it sometimes like, you know,

 

869

00:45:43,240 –> 00:45:47,360

my fashion post on Instagram now where I’m like excited about living flat.

 

870

00:45:47,360 –> 00:45:50,080

And I am, but at the same time, it wasn’t easy.

 

871

00:45:50,080 –> 00:45:53,960

You know, I met my husband after cancer, as I said, so he only knew me with scars and

 

872

00:45:53,960 –> 00:45:56,720

his support also was a really big factor in that.

 

873

00:45:56,720 –> 00:46:00,640

And at the same time, it’s also saying like, F you to the whole patriarchal idea that I

 

874

00:46:00,640 –> 00:46:04,040

need to have breasts, because to me that’s also like, if you want to, and it’s supportive

 

875

00:46:04,040 –> 00:46:05,040

for you.

 

876

00:46:05,040 –> 00:46:07,080

And for me, it was supportive for many years.

 

877

00:46:07,080 –> 00:46:11,360

So like normalizing that and then also saying this isn’t serving me anymore.

 

878

00:46:11,360 –> 00:46:12,360

This is where I’m at.

 

879

00:46:12,360 –> 00:46:14,160

And that’s okay too.

 

880

00:46:14,160 –> 00:46:15,160

Love it.

 

881

00:46:15,160 –> 00:46:16,160

Love it.

 

882

00:46:16,160 –> 00:46:23,520

Can you tell the listeners, what does it mean to have an explant surgery and what that entails?

 

883

00:46:23,520 –> 00:46:25,840

Cause there’s just so many like terminologies.

 

884

00:46:25,840 –> 00:46:26,840

Yeah, sure.

 

885

00:46:26,840 –> 00:46:31,680

So an explant surgery is where it really does depend.

 

886

00:46:31,680 –> 00:46:36,560

So either a plastic surgeon or a breast surgeon, it depends on who you end up getting for the

 

887

00:46:36,560 –> 00:46:41,240

surgery and whether they are willing to do the surgery, which is a whole different other

 

888

00:46:41,240 –> 00:46:43,000

thing, but they’ll remove the breast implant.

 

889

00:46:43,000 –> 00:46:46,160

They’ll remove the capsule that’s around the breast implant.

 

890

00:46:46,160 –> 00:46:50,600

So that’s a capsulectomy and any surrounding like scar tissue to kind of clean up that

 

891

00:46:50,600 –> 00:46:51,600

area.

 

892

00:46:51,600 –> 00:46:54,020

Now there’s different types of flat closure.

 

893

00:46:54,020 –> 00:46:57,480

So there’s flat closure where folks are left with dog ears.

 

894

00:46:57,480 –> 00:47:01,640

So basically there’s extra skin, like what we call the mastectomy flaps.

 

895

00:47:01,640 –> 00:47:04,400

And so sometimes folks are left with this for a couple of reasons.

 

896

00:47:04,400 –> 00:47:07,480

Sometimes they want the option to reconstruct in the future.

 

897

00:47:07,480 –> 00:47:08,480

Great.

 

898

00:47:08,480 –> 00:47:12,040

And then sometimes their doctor didn’t listen to them when they asked for a flat closure

 

899

00:47:12,040 –> 00:47:13,560

and left it.

 

900

00:47:13,560 –> 00:47:17,200

And that’s really devastating because then they have to go back for another surgery to

 

901

00:47:17,200 –> 00:47:18,600

revise that.

 

902

00:47:18,600 –> 00:47:23,960

Now what I had and what I pushed for from my doctor was an aesthetic flat closure.

 

903

00:47:23,960 –> 00:47:28,920

So this is where you remove that extra skin, the mastectomy flaps, so that extra piece,

 

904

00:47:28,920 –> 00:47:34,020

and then you create a smooth or at least as smooth as possible chest surface that is flat

 

905

00:47:34,020 –> 00:47:35,400

all the way around.

 

906

00:47:35,400 –> 00:47:39,240

I originally had two scars that were here and now I have one long scar that goes all

 

907

00:47:39,240 –> 00:47:43,480

the way underneath my armpits on both sides because to remove that extra skin, but it’s

 

908

00:47:43,480 –> 00:47:44,760

one big scar.

 

909

00:47:44,760 –> 00:47:49,240

I don’t have any additional kind of scars at this point, besides the drain, you know,

 

910

00:47:49,240 –> 00:47:51,280

scars and stuff like this, but those will heal.

 

911

00:47:51,280 –> 00:47:56,520

Thank you for saying that because I want the listeners to know the difference because there

 

912

00:47:56,520 –> 00:47:58,160

is a difference.

 

913

00:47:58,160 –> 00:48:05,040

If you decide to go flat and not have like any revision of like going back to implants

 

914

00:48:05,040 –> 00:48:10,040

or getting a tissue flap or any of that, just making sure that you tell your plastic surgeon,

 

915

00:48:10,040 –> 00:48:12,240

no, I want to be flat forever.

 

916

00:48:12,240 –> 00:48:13,240

Essentially.

 

917

00:48:13,240 –> 00:48:14,240

I don’t want to go back.

 

918

00:48:14,240 –> 00:48:18,280

One thing I will recommend for listeners who are even thinking that, you know, one, always

 

919

00:48:18,280 –> 00:48:21,800

happy to talk to anyone that wants to have that conversation about that and then also

 

920

00:48:21,800 –> 00:48:23,960

a good resource is not putting on a shirt.

 

921

00:48:23,960 –> 00:48:27,560

They have a lot of resources for different surgeons that are like cleared, like they

 

922

00:48:27,560 –> 00:48:32,160

are known for doing aesthetic flat closure, are willing to do it, are open to it because

 

923

00:48:32,160 –> 00:48:35,900

sometimes doctors near you are not necessarily open.

 

924

00:48:35,900 –> 00:48:37,000

My doctor was supportive.

 

925

00:48:37,000 –> 00:48:40,440

I was lucky for that and I think part of it was because I had been a survivor so long,

 

926

00:48:40,440 –> 00:48:42,640

so I was able to advocate for myself in that way.

 

927

00:48:42,640 –> 00:48:46,420

But if you’re someone who wants to do this directly, right, as your bilateral mastectomy

 

928

00:48:46,420 –> 00:48:51,100

too flat, sometimes that isn’t as supportive, especially for us younger folks.

 

929

00:48:51,100 –> 00:48:57,080

And so just knowing that there’s doctors out there who would be supportive is also another,

 

930

00:48:57,080 –> 00:49:00,520

you know, or at least there’s language and pictures and all these things that you can

 

931

00:49:00,520 –> 00:49:01,520

show your doctors.

 

932

00:49:01,520 –> 00:49:03,000

So that’s a really good resource.

 

933

00:49:03,000 –> 00:49:08,320

They’re not putting on a shirt because aesthetic flat closure is actually a new term in 2020.

 

934

00:49:08,320 –> 00:49:10,200

That term was official.

 

935

00:49:10,200 –> 00:49:15,160

And so that’s a new terminology that’s being used in the cancer community, particularly

 

936

00:49:15,160 –> 00:49:16,160

by doctors.

 

937

00:49:16,160 –> 00:49:17,160

But you mentioned that resource.

 

938

00:49:17,160 –> 00:49:22,080

We’ll put it in our show notes for anyone that wants to take a look.

 

939

00:49:22,080 –> 00:49:29,680

I want to touch on the topic and the symbolism of breast, which in our society means a symbol

 

940

00:49:29,680 –> 00:49:37,080

of beauty, femininity, motherhood, and just being desirable to our partners.

 

941

00:49:37,080 –> 00:49:44,560

Without breast, some women feel self-conscious, unlovable, undesirable, and could play a factor

 

942

00:49:44,560 –> 00:49:47,560

in why women get breast reconstruction.

 

943

00:49:47,560 –> 00:49:53,720

But that being said, in your opinion and like what you’re currently going through, how else

 

944

00:49:53,720 –> 00:49:57,080

can a woman find her beauty and femininity?

 

945

00:49:57,080 –> 00:49:58,080

Yeah.

 

946

00:49:58,080 –> 00:50:02,400

So for me, because again, this is going to be on a spectrum depending on how feminine

 

947

00:50:02,400 –> 00:50:03,400

someone identifies.

 

948

00:50:03,400 –> 00:50:05,600

But for me, I’m quite feminine identifying.

 

949

00:50:05,600 –> 00:50:09,720

And so for me, it’s been finding outfits that work for my new flat body, which is why I’ve

 

950

00:50:09,720 –> 00:50:12,720

been like sharing those posts and things because that’s exciting for me.

 

951

00:50:12,720 –> 00:50:16,800

Just like I feel pretty in this and those have been the enjoyable things to find.

 

952

00:50:16,800 –> 00:50:20,360

And it’s been wearing things I couldn’t wear with my foods because I didn’t have the beautiful

 

953

00:50:20,360 –> 00:50:22,120

cleavage that some women achieve.

 

954

00:50:22,120 –> 00:50:26,520

I had very much a pretty decent space between mine, which some women get depending on your

 

955

00:50:26,520 –> 00:50:29,360

reconstruction and how that falls with your anatomy.

 

956

00:50:29,360 –> 00:50:32,960

There were times where there are certain halter tops and things I can wear now that I would

 

957

00:50:32,960 –> 00:50:37,640

never have worn without a bra, even with no nipples, because my food would just pop out.

 

958

00:50:37,640 –> 00:50:38,640

There was no way.

 

959

00:50:38,640 –> 00:50:40,520

And so it’s been nice finding those things.

 

960

00:50:40,520 –> 00:50:46,140

But even with boobs, too, it was finding things that I felt like sexy in and I felt pretty

 

961

00:50:46,140 –> 00:50:47,400

and beautiful.

 

962

00:50:47,400 –> 00:50:49,660

For me, a lot of it was finding new clothes.

 

963

00:50:49,660 –> 00:50:53,840

It was also just it’s accentuating the other parts or noticing the other parts of your

 

964

00:50:53,840 –> 00:50:56,200

body that you love.

 

965

00:50:56,200 –> 00:50:58,000

Maybe that is your smile.

 

966

00:50:58,000 –> 00:50:59,700

Maybe that is your legs.

 

967

00:50:59,700 –> 00:51:01,160

Maybe that are, you know, that’s your butt.

 

968

00:51:01,160 –> 00:51:02,160

I don’t know.

 

969

00:51:02,160 –> 00:51:06,940

Whatever you feel like, what other parts of your body do you feel confident about?

 

970

00:51:06,940 –> 00:51:10,640

And really thinking about how can I accentuate this, whether that’s in clothing, whether

 

971

00:51:10,640 –> 00:51:14,840

that is just you paying more attention to that and bringing awareness to it.

 

972

00:51:14,840 –> 00:51:18,000

For me, that is how I went about finding it.

 

973

00:51:18,000 –> 00:51:19,420

It’s really those moments.

 

974

00:51:19,420 –> 00:51:22,380

It was really not about other people.

 

975

00:51:22,380 –> 00:51:26,440

Even my husband, it was about myself and how am I feeling beautiful?

 

976

00:51:26,440 –> 00:51:29,060

How am I viewing myself and my body?

 

977

00:51:29,060 –> 00:51:34,400

And so whenever I found something I felt confident in, it was definitely either buying multiple

 

978

00:51:34,400 –> 00:51:41,000

of that outfit or just, you know, noticing the parts of me that I really like about my

 

979

00:51:41,000 –> 00:51:42,000

body.

 

980

00:51:42,000 –> 00:51:45,800

And that can be hard because your body changes through treatment too.

 

981

00:51:45,800 –> 00:51:50,120

If you, you know, chemo with steroids, I gained weight.

 

982

00:51:50,120 –> 00:51:52,080

It was hard to lose weight with tamoxifen.

 

983

00:51:52,080 –> 00:51:58,720

And so it was finding love for a new and very different body, not just because of the reconstruction.

 

984

00:51:58,720 –> 00:52:03,080

And then now with my ex-plank, it’s my body has changed in 10 years and I’m finding every

 

985

00:52:03,080 –> 00:52:08,360

day it’s finding new love for this body that has been changed again and again and again.

 

986

00:52:08,360 –> 00:52:13,440

And it’s different than I think someone who hasn’t gone through something like this, but

 

987

00:52:13,440 –> 00:52:17,440

you know, we often talk about this with women when they go through like menopause or something.

 

988

00:52:17,440 –> 00:52:22,640

Well, for us AYA specifically breast cancer folk, you’re really dealing with this earlier

 

989

00:52:22,640 –> 00:52:26,380

and you’re just processing it earlier, but it’s really where can you find that love for

 

990

00:52:26,380 –> 00:52:27,380

yourself?

 

991

00:52:27,380 –> 00:52:29,200

And also maybe it is the cancer parts too.

 

992

00:52:29,200 –> 00:52:34,240

So for me, it’s touching my scars, really looking at them and seeing them.

 

993

00:52:34,240 –> 00:52:35,640

For some women that isn’t the case.

 

994

00:52:35,640 –> 00:52:37,440

So I again, normalizing that too.

 

995

00:52:37,440 –> 00:52:39,560

Like if looking at your scars is hard, that’s okay.

 

996

00:52:39,560 –> 00:52:41,360

That was hard for me for a long time.

 

997

00:52:41,360 –> 00:52:46,400

So wherever that fits for you, it’s the finding that is important.

 

998

00:52:46,400 –> 00:52:48,360

Thank you so much for your honesty.

 

999

00:52:48,360 –> 00:52:51,960

Rosalina and I had spoken about this a couple of weeks ago, just trying to figure out how

 

1000

00:52:51,960 –> 00:52:56,880

to live in your new body, not only like love it, but like live it.

 

1001

00:52:56,880 –> 00:52:58,840

And that’s, that’s difficult.

 

1002

00:52:58,840 –> 00:53:03,640

It’s hard, especially I think like being new to post-treatment and then our first year

 

1003

00:53:03,640 –> 00:53:06,080

of post-treatment, it’s a really difficult thing.

 

1004

00:53:06,080 –> 00:53:09,480

So, you know, and especially like you said, after 10 years, your body’s already changed.

 

1005

00:53:09,480 –> 00:53:11,680

So you have to keep doing it.

 

1006

00:53:11,680 –> 00:53:15,760

And it’s time, I think too, just giving yourself time and being patient with it too.

 

1007

00:53:15,760 –> 00:53:17,520

I think that’s a big factor.

 

1008

00:53:17,520 –> 00:53:21,540

Because I think we want to rush to get back to whatever we thought we were.

 

1009

00:53:21,540 –> 00:53:22,800

And I definitely had those moments.

 

1010

00:53:22,800 –> 00:53:23,800

Instant gratification.

 

1011

00:53:23,800 –> 00:53:24,800

Yeah.

 

1012

00:53:24,800 –> 00:53:26,680

And I had those moments and I won’t act like I didn’t.

 

1013

00:53:26,680 –> 00:53:30,000

Like I’m not sitting here like, oh no, no, I definitely had those moments where I hated

 

1014

00:53:30,000 –> 00:53:31,000

it.

 

1015

00:53:31,000 –> 00:53:33,200

And there’s still days I’m like, I don’t like this part of my body or I don’t like my body

 

1016

00:53:33,200 –> 00:53:34,200

right now.

 

1017

00:53:34,200 –> 00:53:37,360

And for me, it’s a constant conversation with myself and like, you know, this kind of thought

 

1018

00:53:37,360 –> 00:53:43,220

process of reflection of how am I looking at myself and how can I do this from a place

 

1019

00:53:43,220 –> 00:53:44,840

of self-compassion.

 

1020

00:53:44,840 –> 00:53:50,700

So I know that we’re recording this in June, but your canterversary is coming up next month.

 

1021

00:53:50,700 –> 00:53:53,680

You’re going to hit the 10 year mark.

 

1022

00:53:53,680 –> 00:53:58,480

So Justine, just so you know, I’ve only been diagnosed for a year.

 

1023

00:53:58,480 –> 00:54:02,280

So I’m really new into this community.

 

1024

00:54:02,280 –> 00:54:07,480

But you are the first AYA cancer survivor who I met that’s going to be reaching their

 

1025

00:54:07,480 –> 00:54:08,760

10 year mark.

 

1026

00:54:08,760 –> 00:54:12,600

And I think that’s just an unbelievable, like huge milestone.

 

1027

00:54:12,600 –> 00:54:15,600

You know, I feel like both Shana and I like look up to you.

 

1028

00:54:15,600 –> 00:54:20,880

Can you tell us, you know, how you feel and will you be celebrating?

 

1029

00:54:20,880 –> 00:54:21,880

Yeah.

 

1030

00:54:21,880 –> 00:54:25,240

So first, I’m feeling a ton of emotions, like it’s a lot.

 

1031

00:54:25,240 –> 00:54:28,560

I don’t know if either of you have seen the Disney movie Inside Out, but there’s a whole

 

1032

00:54:28,560 –> 00:54:32,040

like, and that whole ending of that film, there’s like a swirling of emotions.

 

1033

00:54:32,040 –> 00:54:33,760

And like, that’s the whole point is you develop.

 

1034

00:54:33,760 –> 00:54:35,800

I love that movie so much.

 

1035

00:54:35,800 –> 00:54:37,480

I thought it was like the per I’m not kidding.

 

1036

00:54:37,480 –> 00:54:40,840

I thought it was the perfect way to explain like, especially emotions to kids when we

 

1037

00:54:40,840 –> 00:54:44,320

don’t understand how big feelings and how fast things can change.

 

1038

00:54:44,320 –> 00:54:47,520

I thought that movie was incredible and so underrated.

 

1039

00:54:47,520 –> 00:54:50,880

And what I like about it just and it’s not giving away anything too big.

 

1040

00:54:50,880 –> 00:54:54,120

But as we age, emotions become really complex and they become intermingled.

 

1041

00:54:54,120 –> 00:54:55,120

Right.

 

1042

00:54:55,120 –> 00:54:57,480

You’re not just experiencing one and then the other, like you’re actually experiencing

 

1043

00:54:57,480 –> 00:54:59,880

anger and happiness or anger and sadness.

 

1044

00:54:59,880 –> 00:55:03,880

Like these things all commingle because that’s how we really experience emotions.

 

1045

00:55:03,880 –> 00:55:08,400

My point that I was trying to make here was that I’m feeling a lot of everything.

 

1046

00:55:08,400 –> 00:55:09,400

I’m excited.

 

1047

00:55:09,400 –> 00:55:11,760

Of course I’m excited, but I’m really nervous.

 

1048

00:55:11,760 –> 00:55:14,840

Like every day that goes by, I’m like, oh my God, okay, how am I feeling?

 

1049

00:55:14,840 –> 00:55:15,840

How am I feeling?

 

1050

00:55:15,840 –> 00:55:16,840

Do I feel okay?

 

1051

00:55:16,840 –> 00:55:17,840

Okay.

 

1052

00:55:17,840 –> 00:55:20,840

And like that, those type of questions, I’m overwhelmed a little bit because I, when I

 

1053

00:55:20,840 –> 00:55:24,240

was diagnosed, if you were, you know, I’m sure you were given these, but you get those

 

1054

00:55:24,240 –> 00:55:25,240

statistics, right?

 

1055

00:55:25,240 –> 00:55:29,520

Of like what your recurrence rate looks like if you do certain X, Y treatments, you, what,

 

1056

00:55:29,520 –> 00:55:32,480

how likely are you, is it that you’re going to be here in 10 years?

 

1057

00:55:32,480 –> 00:55:34,000

Like they give you the mortality rate stuff.

 

1058

00:55:34,000 –> 00:55:35,800

At least I was given that.

 

1059

00:55:35,800 –> 00:55:38,400

And I remember that stuck out to me.

 

1060

00:55:38,400 –> 00:55:43,520

Like when I was diagnosed, like so strongly, I remember thinking, well, if I make it to

 

1061

00:55:43,520 –> 00:55:45,480

30, I’m going to be stoked.

 

1062

00:55:45,480 –> 00:55:47,000

I made it to 30.

 

1063

00:55:47,000 –> 00:55:50,960

Now I’m looking to 40 and I’m like, all right, let’s go to 40.

 

1064

00:55:50,960 –> 00:55:55,280

And that’s all I can really do is like, I’m kind of going every 10 years, like, all right,

 

1065

00:55:55,280 –> 00:55:56,280

let’s make it 10 more.

 

1066

00:55:56,280 –> 00:55:57,280

I hope I do.

 

1067

00:55:57,280 –> 00:56:01,240

Like I’m really hopeful about that, but I also like, it’s a, it’s a really, it’s a lot

 

1068

00:56:01,240 –> 00:56:02,240

of existentialism.

 

1069

00:56:02,240 –> 00:56:06,480

Like a lot of my therapy was like processing that where it’s like, well, we’ll see.

 

1070

00:56:06,480 –> 00:56:07,720

And you know, that’s okay.

 

1071

00:56:07,720 –> 00:56:08,720

I will be celebrating.

 

1072

00:56:08,720 –> 00:56:12,840

Like my plan is I’m going to celebrate with my husband and with family and even next this

 

1073

00:56:12,840 –> 00:56:15,380

coming week, I’m going on a retreat.

 

1074

00:56:15,380 –> 00:56:16,380

So pride retreat.

 

1075

00:56:16,380 –> 00:56:17,380

Yes, I saw.

 

1076

00:56:17,380 –> 00:56:18,380

Yeah.

 

1077

00:56:18,380 –> 00:56:19,380

Yeah.

 

1078

00:56:19,380 –> 00:56:20,380

That’s exciting.

 

1079

00:56:20,380 –> 00:56:21,380

Yeah.

 

1080

00:56:21,380 –> 00:56:24,520

And so just for context with the listeners, it’s a retreat for breast cancer affected

 

1081

00:56:24,520 –> 00:56:26,440

folks, pre-biover survivors and divers.

 

1082

00:56:26,440 –> 00:56:30,280

And we’re all getting together as a small group of us, like 18 of us getting together

 

1083

00:56:30,280 –> 00:56:32,240

and just connecting in Florida.

 

1084

00:56:32,240 –> 00:56:34,160

And it’s going to be really awesome.

 

1085

00:56:34,160 –> 00:56:36,640

We’ve already kind of connected virtually over the past year.

 

1086

00:56:36,640 –> 00:56:41,840

And so it’s going to be really exciting to be in space together and just, and I think

 

1087

00:56:41,840 –> 00:56:46,520

it’s a really nice way to like lead into my 10 year cancerversary because I, you know,

 

1088

00:56:46,520 –> 00:56:49,720

I haven’t been to a retreat in like three years because of COVID.

 

1089

00:56:49,720 –> 00:56:53,760

And so I’m really excited just to be in space with people and to who get it.

 

1090

00:56:53,760 –> 00:56:54,760

Yeah.

 

1091

00:56:54,760 –> 00:57:00,200

I’m going to mention the pride retreat is run by Yara and we support her so much.

 

1092

00:57:00,200 –> 00:57:04,200

So I’ll link her Instagram in the show notes as well.

 

1093

00:57:04,200 –> 00:57:06,240

So everyone knows about that.

 

1094

00:57:06,240 –> 00:57:11,560

And they also run this program where like, if you sign up, you can get free coffee.

 

1095

00:57:11,560 –> 00:57:12,560

Yeah.

 

1096

00:57:12,560 –> 00:57:15,680

So yeah, you can sign up and get free coffee if you’re a breast cancer survivor, cancer

 

1097

00:57:15,680 –> 00:57:16,680

survivor.

 

1098

00:57:16,680 –> 00:57:17,680

So yeah, definitely do that.

 

1099

00:57:17,680 –> 00:57:18,680

It’s really cool.

 

1100

00:57:18,680 –> 00:57:22,560

And the work she’s doing, I mean, she’s also in like a little bit past you both in terms

 

1101

00:57:22,560 –> 00:57:26,520

of like post-treatment, but also like in a space where very much newer to this.

 

1102

00:57:26,520 –> 00:57:29,640

And it’s just like go hit in the ground running and like doing things in the community.

 

1103

00:57:29,640 –> 00:57:30,640

And I love it.

 

1104

00:57:30,640 –> 00:57:31,640

I love it so much.

 

1105

00:57:31,640 –> 00:57:32,640

So it’s wonderful.

 

1106

00:57:32,640 –> 00:57:33,640

It was a nice pick me up.

 

1107

00:57:33,640 –> 00:57:34,640

I got a free cup of coffee.

 

1108

00:57:34,640 –> 00:57:35,640

I think it was a nice pick me up.

 

1109

00:57:35,640 –> 00:57:38,640

And it was just like, it was such a nice like, it made my day actually.

 

1110

00:57:38,640 –> 00:57:41,720

You don’t even realize it made my day too.

 

1111

00:57:41,720 –> 00:57:43,720

Honestly, such a great feeling.

 

1112

00:57:43,720 –> 00:57:44,720

Yeah.

 

1113

00:57:44,720 –> 00:57:45,720

Yeah.

 

1114

00:57:45,720 –> 00:57:49,200

Lastly, let’s just get into your meditation practice.

 

1115

00:57:49,200 –> 00:57:54,600

As I mentioned in the beginning to the listeners, you know, you host a weekly meditation for

 

1116

00:57:54,600 –> 00:57:56,520

the breast cancer community.

 

1117

00:57:56,520 –> 00:57:57,600

Why did you start this?

 

1118

00:57:57,600 –> 00:58:03,840

I had practiced yoga sporadically throughout my like survivorship throughout college.

 

1119

00:58:03,840 –> 00:58:08,480

And after my revision surgery, I just realized I really needed to heal from like a place

 

1120

00:58:08,480 –> 00:58:10,700

of like self compassion and kindness.

 

1121

00:58:10,700 –> 00:58:15,240

And so I really began a yoga practice and meditation practice.

 

1122

00:58:15,240 –> 00:58:19,440

And I did that for a couple of years and then realized I really wanted to share this with

 

1123

00:58:19,440 –> 00:58:22,920

the community because I, you know, as I shared earlier, I’m a college professor.

 

1124

00:58:22,920 –> 00:58:25,640

So teaching is kind of part of me as a person.

 

1125

00:58:25,640 –> 00:58:29,160

I like to teach other people and be in space in that way.

 

1126

00:58:29,160 –> 00:58:33,440

And for me, yoga was just so healing for me.

 

1127

00:58:33,440 –> 00:58:35,520

It helped me conduct to my body.

 

1128

00:58:35,520 –> 00:58:40,840

It helped me remind me that I have a breath when things get overwhelming during survivorship.

 

1129

00:58:40,840 –> 00:58:45,040

And so I decided to get certified as a yoga teacher.

 

1130

00:58:45,040 –> 00:58:48,560

And I finished that certification in May, 2021.

 

1131

00:58:48,560 –> 00:58:52,360

So not, you know, about a year ago, the whole purpose of getting that training was to connect

 

1132

00:58:52,360 –> 00:58:53,400

to the cancer community.

 

1133

00:58:53,400 –> 00:58:55,440

Like I would be, that was really what I wanted.

 

1134

00:58:55,440 –> 00:58:59,960

It wasn’t about just like teaching other people, like again, everyone do their thing, but that’s

 

1135

00:58:59,960 –> 00:59:00,960

why I did it.

 

1136

00:59:00,960 –> 00:59:03,000

Because for me, it was so healing personally.

 

1137

00:59:03,000 –> 00:59:05,200

I played around with how am I going to do this?

 

1138

00:59:05,200 –> 00:59:06,200

I don’t know.

 

1139

00:59:06,200 –> 00:59:08,040

And I kind of put things out there.

 

1140

00:59:08,040 –> 00:59:13,040

And then finally I said, okay, I’m just going to start a meditation group because anyone,

 

1141

00:59:13,040 –> 00:59:17,080

whether you’re in treatment, surgery, et cetera, can come to a space and engage in meditation.

 

1142

00:59:17,080 –> 00:59:19,320

Like movement practice is a little bit different, right?

 

1143

00:59:19,320 –> 00:59:25,160

It could, you know, there’s limitations, but with meditation, anyone can join whenever.

 

1144

00:59:25,160 –> 00:59:27,480

And so I said, let’s just try this.

 

1145

00:59:27,480 –> 00:59:31,720

So a little before Thanksgiving in November of 2021, I said, I’m just going to put it

 

1146

00:59:31,720 –> 00:59:32,720

out there on Instagram.

 

1147

00:59:32,720 –> 00:59:34,400

We’ll see who shows.

 

1148

00:59:34,400 –> 00:59:38,540

And I got an immense response of people just like signing, wanting to sign up and hear

 

1149

00:59:38,540 –> 00:59:39,540

about it.

 

1150

00:59:39,540 –> 00:59:43,000

And what’s been really nice is I’ve had the spaces like really transformed.

 

1151

00:59:43,000 –> 00:59:47,240

Like I’ve had several consistent attendees and a lot of repeat attendees.

 

1152

00:59:47,240 –> 00:59:51,520

What really started out with me, like sharing meditation with other folks impacted by breast

 

1153

00:59:51,520 –> 00:59:56,440

cancer has really become a space for folks to also check in where we check in with each

 

1154

00:59:56,440 –> 00:59:57,440

other.

 

1155

00:59:57,440 –> 00:59:58,440

How is your week going?

 

1156

00:59:58,440 –> 00:59:59,440

And some weeks are great for people.

 

1157

00:59:59,440 –> 01:00:00,440

Like they don’t have much to report.

 

1158

01:00:00,440 –> 01:00:02,720

And then some weeks I am struggling right now.

 

1159

01:00:02,720 –> 01:00:04,040

You know, I’m dealing with pain.

 

1160

01:00:04,040 –> 01:00:05,760

I’m finishing chemo.

 

1161

01:00:05,760 –> 01:00:08,000

I’m doing this, whatever it may be.

 

1162

01:00:08,000 –> 01:00:12,200

You know, even when I was before my surgery, like we had meditation group the Sunday before

 

1163

01:00:12,200 –> 01:00:13,440

my explant surgery.

 

1164

01:00:13,440 –> 01:00:17,360

And I shared all about my fears leading into that because I was nervous.

 

1165

01:00:17,360 –> 01:00:22,520

I mean, even if I’ve had surgery before, it’s really a cool space is what I would say.

 

1166

01:00:22,520 –> 01:00:25,800

Like it’s, it’s the group is really open to trying different meditations, which has been

 

1167

01:00:25,800 –> 01:00:26,800

fun.

 

1168

01:00:26,800 –> 01:00:30,720

So we’ve done stuff around self-compassion stuff like body scans and just all these different

 

1169

01:00:30,720 –> 01:00:31,720

types of things.

 

1170

01:00:31,720 –> 01:00:32,720

And I love guiding the space.

 

1171

01:00:32,720 –> 01:00:37,680

And it’s been really, really supportive for me in this later stage of my survivorship.

 

1172

01:00:37,680 –> 01:00:43,640

And it’s been really nice to connect to people who many of them are in it or post in it.

 

1173

01:00:43,640 –> 01:00:46,120

And they’re like processing this stuff.

 

1174

01:00:46,120 –> 01:00:49,740

And it’s not, I wouldn’t call it a support group because it’s not that, but it is a space

 

1175

01:00:49,740 –> 01:00:53,120

for folks to come and be in space with other people who get it.

 

1176

01:00:53,120 –> 01:00:59,280

You probably make someone’s day by providing that meditation weekly.

 

1177

01:00:59,280 –> 01:01:05,800

There are times where you can’t share what you’re going through with your family members,

 

1178

01:01:05,800 –> 01:01:08,380

your friends, because you don’t want to be a burden.

 

1179

01:01:08,380 –> 01:01:15,720

When you offer that space to women, they feel like they could talk about it with people

 

1180

01:01:15,720 –> 01:01:17,380

who get it.

 

1181

01:01:17,380 –> 01:01:20,280

And I think that’s just super important.

 

1182

01:01:20,280 –> 01:01:22,360

And we need this type of community.

 

1183

01:01:22,360 –> 01:01:25,540

We need every resource that we can get.

 

1184

01:01:25,540 –> 01:01:32,160

I feel like I always say why I did that in the beginning is one thing I never felt through

 

1185

01:01:32,160 –> 01:01:34,560

my own journey was seen.

 

1186

01:01:34,560 –> 01:01:40,840

I just felt like no one saw me through that, the real me of what I was dealing with.

 

1187

01:01:40,840 –> 01:01:46,000

And the only people that can truly really see you are the people that get it.

 

1188

01:01:46,000 –> 01:01:49,320

And even if their experiences are slightly different, they get it.

 

1189

01:01:49,320 –> 01:01:55,160

And so I think that’s really what these different resources, I had this thought I had meant

 

1190

01:01:55,160 –> 01:01:59,760

to mention it while we were chatting, but I love the name of the podcast for you all

 

1191

01:01:59,760 –> 01:02:00,760

because I love it.

 

1192

01:02:00,760 –> 01:02:01,760

I literally read that.

 

1193

01:02:01,760 –> 01:02:03,480

I was like, too young for this shit.

 

1194

01:02:03,480 –> 01:02:06,480

That’s me every day.

 

1195

01:02:06,480 –> 01:02:13,960

But if I was a young survivor and that’s the resource I wish I had had, those are the things

 

1196

01:02:13,960 –> 01:02:19,080

and that’s what I really hope to provide is these are the things we wish we had.

 

1197

01:02:19,080 –> 01:02:24,320

And so my hope moving forward and right now it’s like the best way to connect to me is

 

1198

01:02:24,320 –> 01:02:28,200

really on Instagram because I’m still working on like, you know, again, I only got certified

 

1199

01:02:28,200 –> 01:02:29,200

about a year ago.

 

1200

01:02:29,200 –> 01:02:31,400

So these are new things for me that I’m working on.

 

1201

01:02:31,400 –> 01:02:35,840

But my hope, I just finished a training focused around cancer patients.

 

1202

01:02:35,840 –> 01:02:40,280

So like yoga for cancer patients, both like subtle and more physical practices.

 

1203

01:02:40,280 –> 01:02:44,920

And my hope is to offer more things for cancer patients in general for the in the future.

 

1204

01:02:44,920 –> 01:02:49,200

It’s more just giving myself space and grace to do that work incrementally.

 

1205

01:02:49,200 –> 01:02:53,160

But you know, the best way for folks to kind of make sure that, you know, they’re staying

 

1206

01:02:53,160 –> 01:02:56,880

up to date on that is just following me on Instagram because and staying on my email

 

1207

01:02:56,880 –> 01:02:59,980

list too, which is they can access through my Instagram.

 

1208

01:02:59,980 –> 01:03:03,720

You know, it’s a good way to kind of stay connected and hear about what I hope to offer

 

1209

01:03:03,720 –> 01:03:04,720

moving forward.

 

1210

01:03:04,720 –> 01:03:06,560

Yeah, so that’s perfect.

 

1211

01:03:06,560 –> 01:03:12,480

I love that you hooked your IG and let us know where we can find you, which we’ll also

 

1212

01:03:12,480 –> 01:03:14,400

put in the show notes.

 

1213

01:03:14,400 –> 01:03:21,960

With that being said, at the end of our episode, we just like to ask a fun mystery question.

 

1214

01:03:21,960 –> 01:03:24,400

So Sean, I take it away.

 

1215

01:03:24,400 –> 01:03:26,120

What is your go to karaoke song?

 

1216

01:03:26,120 –> 01:03:27,120

That’s an easy answer.

 

1217

01:03:27,120 –> 01:03:28,120

Party in the USA by my.

 

1218

01:03:28,120 –> 01:03:29,120

That’s so funny.

 

1219

01:03:29,120 –> 01:03:30,120

You didn’t even hesitate.

 

1220

01:03:30,120 –> 01:03:34,320

That is definitely my go to karaoke song.

 

1221

01:03:34,320 –> 01:03:35,720

I love that song.

 

1222

01:03:35,720 –> 01:03:40,840

It’s it is the song that just immediately elicits joy.

 

1223

01:03:40,840 –> 01:03:43,080

So yeah, that’s it.

 

1224

01:03:43,080 –> 01:03:44,080

Everyone knows it.

 

1225

01:03:44,080 –> 01:03:47,840

Man, woman, everyone knows that song.

 

1226

01:03:47,840 –> 01:03:49,600

It’s a crowd pleaser for sure.

 

1227

01:03:49,600 –> 01:03:54,480

Stine, thank you so much for being on this podcast.

 

1228

01:03:54,480 –> 01:04:02,440

I know that we became like internet friends through Instagram, but I love that we got

 

1229

01:04:02,440 –> 01:04:04,520

to know you even more.

 

1230

01:04:04,520 –> 01:04:06,400

And yeah, you’re just so incredible.

 

1231

01:04:06,400 –> 01:04:11,440

You’re so honest about your experience and so confident, too.

 

1232

01:04:11,440 –> 01:04:13,880

I just want to mention that as well.

 

1233

01:04:13,880 –> 01:04:18,360

It’s making me excited now for like every year that’s going to pass for me.

 

1234

01:04:18,360 –> 01:04:21,280

Hopefully, you know, getting to a 10 year mark, I think.

 

1235

01:04:21,280 –> 01:04:23,640

I’m like, I’m you’ve made me so excited for it.

 

1236

01:04:23,640 –> 01:04:25,200

I really you all are too sweet.

 

1237

01:04:25,200 –> 01:04:26,200

I appreciate it.

 

1238

01:04:26,200 –> 01:04:27,880

Thank you so much for having me here.

 

1239

01:04:27,880 –> 01:04:32,120

Like it was really nice to connect and be in space and, you know, just share.

 

1240

01:04:32,120 –> 01:04:33,120

It was so wild.

 

1241

01:04:33,120 –> 01:04:36,440

Like I was trying to distill these 10 years and it was really nice to do that and think

 

1242

01:04:36,440 –> 01:04:39,160

about that intentionally as I approached this time.

 

1243

01:04:39,160 –> 01:04:41,880

And so I just really like the timing of this with you all.

 

1244

01:04:41,880 –> 01:04:43,720

It was it was it was great.

 

1245

01:04:43,720 –> 01:04:46,440

The blessing I would just say is thank you so much.

 

1246

01:04:46,440 –> 01:04:50,680

And the years they can be hard, but then there are also so much joy in those years.

 

1247

01:04:50,680 –> 01:04:55,680

So like it’s like finding the joy and also letting you yourself feel those emotions for

 

1248

01:04:55,680 –> 01:04:56,680

those listeners.

 

1249

01:04:56,680 –> 01:04:57,680

So thank you so much.

 

1250

01:04:57,680 –> 01:05:02,680

Thank you all for listening and supporting our podcast.

 

1251

01:05:02,680 –> 01:05:07,960

Sharing our stories with you has been incredibly healing for both of us and we hope it helps

 

1252

01:05:07,960 –> 01:05:10,960

other women in their journeys through breast cancer.

 

1253

01:05:10,960 –> 01:05:15,840

Ladies, if you enjoyed this episode, please share it with your friends and fellow breasties.

 

1254

01:05:15,840 –> 01:05:20,720

Help us reach more women by subscribing and rating us on Apple Podcasts, Spotify and now

 

1255

01:05:20,720 –> 01:05:21,720

on YouTube.

 

1256

01:05:21,720 –> 01:05:29,480

You can follow us on Instagram at TYFTSpodcast and email us at TYFTSpodcast at gmail.com.

 

1257

01:05:29,480 –> 01:05:32,360

We love hearing from you guys, so shoot us a message.

 

1258

01:05:32,360 –> 01:05:46,000

We will link any resources from that episode in our show notes.